Randy Travis (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

• Featured article candidates/Randy Travis/archive1

Nominator(s): Ten Pound Hammer • ^{(What did I screw up now?)} 05:41, 17 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Randy Travis is of the most iconic country music singers and a leader in the neotraditional country genre; he also has a fascinating backstory regarding how he handled losing his singing ability to a stroke. I recently re-wrote the entire thing top to bottom, getting it successfully to GA and featured in DYK. It's one of my longer and more exhaustively sourced contributions, so I feel it might have the goods to become my first ever FA. Ten Pound Hammer • ^{(What did I screw up now?)} 05:41, 17 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Image review

• Don't use fixed px size

• File:Randytravis.jpg: source link is dead. Nikkimaria (talk) 05:30, 18 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Nikkimaria: Done. Ten Pound Hammer • ^{(What did I screw up now?)} 20:46, 18 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

• I'll take a look at this one over the next few days -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 08:21, 19 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

• There's five consecutive sentences in the second paragraph which use his surname. Suggest alternating with "he" for variety
• "Travis released "Where That Came From", his first studio recording since his stroke, where his voice was" => "Travis released "Where That Came From", his first studio recording since his stroke, for which his voice was"
• "Travis also holds several film and television acting roles" - not sure "holds" really works here. Maybe "undertook"?
• The "biography" section only covers the first 18 or so years of his life so I don't think that's an appropriate heading. "Early life" would be better.
• "Randy's then-future wife" - just "Randy's future wife" is sufficient, the context is clear
• "After doing so, he began to hold a conversation with Hatcher" - I think "After doing so, he held a conversation with Hatcher " is fine
• " under the custody of the Hatchers" - only one Hatcher has been mentioned, which other Hatchers were there? -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 16:30, 20 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  @ChrisTheDude: I think I've addressed your issues up to here. The 1990 Cusic book does not clarify who else was in the Hatcher household at the time and just says "the Hatchers", so I changed it to just mention Lib as she's the only notable Hatcher in that context. Ten Pound Hammer • ^{(What did I screw up now?)} 22:33, 20 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

• "His first contract with them resulted in the recording of four songs. These were "Prairie Rose", "On the Other Hand", "Carrying Fire", and "Reasons I Cheat"." => "His first contract with them resulted in the recording of four songs: "Prairie Rose", "On the Other Hand", "Carrying Fire", and "Reasons I Cheat"."
• "For this capacity," - don't think "capacity" is really the right word here. Maybe just lose those three words completely?
• "Next was Travis's twelfth number-one "Forever Together"," => "Next was Travis's twelfth number one, "Forever Together","
• "AllMusic writer Thom Owens said of Full Circle, "his mid-'90s albums suffered from a tendency to sound a bit too similar too each other." - second "too" is spelt incorrectly, also there's no closing quote mark
• "the first performances with Dupré cut back to three concerts" => "the first performances with Dupré were cut back to three concerts"
• "For much of his career, Travis was managed by Elizabeth "Lib" Hatcher, a former nightclub owner." - I don't think you need to restate this, as it was covered above. Maybe just start this section with "Travis and Hatcher lived togrther..."
• Some of the last paragraph of "personal life" feels like it overlaps with the last part of the "career" section and might fit better there......?
• That's all I got on the rest of the article - nice work! -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 16:24, 22 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
• Support -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 10:28, 23 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Looks pretty good. But some comments to prove I read it:

• "Travis wrote "I Told You So" by himself in 1982 around the time he attempted to sign with Curb Records. Monk had also submitted the song to Lee Greenwood at that time, although he declined it. Both Darrell Clanton and Barbara Mandrell had recorded the song as well," "Also" seems out of place here, and "as well" is a poor choice of words, as on first reading it seems to refer to Greenwood. Consider re-wording.
• "Overall, Always & Forever and its singles accounted for a number of award wins and nominations" "Overall" seems out of place here, and I know some editors hate "a number of", preferring "several" or "numerous"
• "It also accounted for Travis's second consecutive Grammy Award". It was his first consecutive
• Didn't Travis sing "Forever and Ever, Amen" at the 30th Grammy Awards?
• "and Clint Eastwood" ??? Clint Eastwood?
• "Next was Travis's twelfth number-one" Break paragraph before here (and comma after "one")
• "Jackson also co-wrote ... while Travis also co-wrote" repetition here, and "also" is unnecessary. Consider re-wording
• "Travis said that he intentionally wrote more songs for the album than previous ones, as he had fewer tour dates and thus had more time to focus on songwriting." That makes it sound like it was not intentional
• Consider moving the two paragraphs about his stroke from Personal life up to 2013–present
• "Another singer who cites Travis as an influence" We haven't said that Singletary does, so no first one has been cited yet.
• "Travis and his wife selected Dupré" You haven't introduced her yet, so the reader might think you are referring to Hatcher
• You have to admire a couple who live together for twenty years and then divorce on the grounds of incompatibility.
• "On January 31, 2013," This is out of chronological order.
• "Video of the incident was aired on the Investigation Discovery program Exposed: Naked Crimes on December 26, 2023." Citation required here.

That's all! Have a merry Christmas! Hawkeye7 (discuss) 19:56, 22 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@ChrisTheDude: @Hawkeye7: I think I got everything up to here. Ten Pound Hammer • ^{(What did I screw up now?)} 22:59, 22 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I'll review this soon. Hog Farm _Talk 01:26, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

• "Although some radio disc jockeys considered the song "too country"," - I think there needs to be some mention about the prevalent pop country at the time to provide context as to why more traditional-sounding country music was considered a potential liability at the time
  • The extra info about contrasting it with pop-country is not supported by the Cusic book, and I feel saying something like that would be a WP:SYNTH violation. I rewrote that section.
• "One track on the album was Dennis Linde's composition "What'll You Do About Me", which was previously released by Steve Earle in 1984" - the cited page doesn't seem to actually say that this track was on the Travis album?
  • Added a source confirming this part.
• "Nine years after its release, it was certified double-platinum" and "In 1997, Old 8×10 received its highest certification of double-platinum." - I think we only need one of these statements
  • Got that.
• "(also titled "Down with the Old Man (Up with the New)")," - source only mentions the Down with the Old Man portion of this subtitle
  • Added a source. I legit thought I'd already put that Billboard article in there.
• "This footage consisted of him singing Christmas songs and reading Helen Steiner Rice's poem "The Christmas Guest" inside the Big Room, a cavern at Carlsbad Caverns National Park." - I'm not seeing a mention to the Rice poem in the linked article
  • This was an error on my part. The Travis/Abraham book mentions the poem, and I accidentally shifted the footnote.
• " As of 2024, Dupré still tours in this capacity alongside Travis" - source is from 2023
  • Fixed.
• The lead mentions multiple appearances on Matlock, but the body only mentions the house painter one
  • Fixed.
• ""Nude Travis demanded smokes?". August 13, 2012. Archived from the original on January 15, 2013. Retrieved March 13, 2021." - this appears to be from Canoe.com, under the now-usurped canoe.ca webname, which was a news aggregator and web portal. Is this a high-quality RS, especially for more salacious material such as naked celebrities demanding cigarettes?
  • Removed.

I think the content is mostly fine, but this could benefit from a specific source-text integrity check; I found several little bits where the sourcing doesn't explicitly support all the details. Hog Farm _Talk 01:26, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

• @Hog Farm: Think I got everything. I admit with an article of this length I probably got sloppy in a couple spots. The Cusic book is on archive.org and can be verified. Ten Pound Hammer • ^{(What did I screw up now?)} 04:40, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

• I'm comfortable with the content, but I'd like to hold off on formally supporting until after the customary spot-check of source-text integrity for first-time nominations. Hog Farm _Talk 00:40, 3 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

  • @Hog Farm: Who would do the source check?

  Ten Pound Hammer • ^{(What did I screw up now?)} 18:06, 8 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

  • It's a standard requirement for a first-time FAC nominator; I'll put it on Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates/Image and source check requests and hopefully somebody will take a look. Hog Farm _Talk 23:45, 10 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Kinda wonder why "Randy Travis: king of the new country traditionalists" isn't cited even once on Google Scholar, especially as the other books are. Remind me, what makes https://ew.com/article/1990/10/12/notable-country-album-releases/ a reliable source? Same question for https://www.whiskeyriff.com/, https://tasteofcountry.com/randy-travis-tribute-concert-stars-remarks/, https://www.acmcountry.com/winners?awardTitle=randy+travis&awardCategory=&awardYear=&actionButton=Submit and https://www.wideopencountry.com/fools-love-affair-randy-travis/. AllMusic sometimes has a byline and sometimes not. Italics too are sometimes inconsistent, I think People should have them for example. https://www.maconcentreplex.org/event/music-of-randy-travis/ needs an archive; best check every link. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 14:26, 4 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

You seriously don't think Entertainment Weekly is a reliable source? Or that the Academy of Country Music's own website is reliable for verifying award nominations and wins from that organization? Taste of Country has been deemed a reliable source per Wikipedia:WikiProject Albums/Sources, so that one should be fine. I'll see about Wide Open Country and Whiskey Riff, and work on italics. Ten Pound Hammer • ^{(What did I screw up now?)} 22:19, 4 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

@Jo-Jo Eumerus: Think I got everything mentioned. Ten Pound Hammer • ^{(What did I screw up now?)} 22:29, 4 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry, seems like I got my wires crossed re EW and AoCM. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 07:44, 5 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Spotcheck as requested, on this revision:

• 3 Can I have a copy of this page?
• 16 Where's "executives"?
• 17 Doesn't say that copies were distributed, just that it was promoted.
• 19 Can I have a copy of this page?
• 20 OK
• 23 OK
• 33 A bit of rewrite may be needed, as it's very similar to the source.
• 55 Can I have a copy of this page?
• 59 Can I have a copy of this page?
• 65 Can I have a copy of this page?
• 110 Can I have a copy of this page?
• 117 Can I have a copy of this page?
• 125 OK
• 131 OK
• 143 Can I have a copy of this page?
• 174 OK
• 184 Can I have a copy of this page?
• 186 Can I have a copy of this page?
• 190 Can I have a copy of this page?
• 193 Broken source.

Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 10:25, 11 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

@Jo-Jo Eumerus: I've had a messed up sleep schedule the last couple days so I'll get on these. Ten Pound Hammer • ^{(What did I screw up now?)} 01:48, 13 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

@Jo-Jo Eumerus: Citations from the Cusic book can be corroborated here. How do you suggest I show clippings from the Abraham book?

59 is a Tenessean website article that loads just fine on my end. 65 is the Joel Whitburn book; again, how do you recommend I show you a page from it?

I think I clipped all the newspaper articles you asked to see. Ten Pound Hammer • ^{(What did I screw up now?)} 18:26, 13 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

I suspect the problem is that I don't live in the US so the cookie-nuisance geoblock applies. Dunno what you mean by "clipping"; I figure you could quote the text from the source that supports a claim, or upload a screenshot to a Google Drive document. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 10:34, 14 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

@Jo-Jo Eumerus: On the newspapers.com articles you asked for, I used their "clipping" feature to change the link, so you can read the article without a newspapers.com subscription. This would account for sources 55, 117, 143, 185 (Albuquerque Journal), 187 (Press Gazette), and 191. (The latter three got shifted ahead a number since your initial sweep, because I added another footnote.) I also removed the one source that was broken.

The text in the Tennessean article, if you can't see it, reads Travis lays out his devotion in his signature song, and listeners haven't stopped loving it since its release in 1987.

Here are quotes from the books.

3. (Travis & Abraham 2019, 3): From the time I was born as Randyy Bruce Traywick--on May 4, 1959 in Marshville, North Carolina...I was one of six kids in the Traywick household. My mama, Bobbie Traywick...My brother Ricky is the oldest, thirteen months older than me. I'm second in line...our dad, Harold Traywick, was a tall lean man... I did remove Bobbie's maiden name which is in neither source, and I think might have been added by someone else.

19. (Cusic 1990, 29, 40): 29 says In 1980 Lib sold the 250-seat club and bought a 400-seat club with a motel next door. Page 40 reads Still, by the end of 1981, they were ready to take the next big step...Thus began a period when Randy and Lib were keeping their ties in both Charlotte and Nashville. They would spend Friday, Saturday, and Sunday in Charlotte, playing at Country City USA, then in the early hours of Monday morning hop into their car... Pages 31 and 40 still call it "Country City USA" after the mention of the 400-seat club being bought, suggesting the latter still used the Country City USA name.

65. (Whitburn 2017, 353): Supernaw, Doug.... 1/14/95, [16] [20] "What'll You Do About Me" -- Dennis Linde. The source is a list of all Hot Country Songs charted singles by every artist, with 1/14/95 being the week it debuted on the charts, #16 being its peak, and 20 the number of weeks it spent on the chart, along with the song's title and writer(s). The Steve Earle book at citation 63 references the song as Dennis Linde's "What'll You Do About Me"...in 1987 Randy Travis would cut the song on his hit Always & Forever album. As Whitburn 2017 verifies that Doug Supernaw's "What'll You Do About Me" was written by Dennis Linde, I do not feel it's original research to say it's the same song. (This also applies to Whitburn 2017, p. 130, which also lists the song title and Linde credit.)

110. (Travis & Abraham 2019, 142) In one meeting with the Warner execs, we were discussing songs that I planned to record. Warner expressed concern that some of my selections weren't as good as others we were considering. Lib countered with her concern that she, Kyle Lehning, and I didn't have as much say as we used to in which songs were being released as singles. Ten Pound Hammer • ^{(What did I screw up now?)} 17:10, 14 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]