The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete all. Wizardman 18:06, 15 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

This Is My Time Tour (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View log)

Prod declined by author. Non-notable tour, little more than just a list of tour dates. Rwiggum (^Talk/_Contrib) 06:27, 10 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Raven-Symoné: Live in Concert Tour (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)

Headstrong Tour Across America (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)

Come as You Are Tour (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)

Ms. Kelly Tour (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)

• Keep I sourced the tour dates, what more do you need. It is a true tour I went to it —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ravenfan4ever (talk • contribs) 06:29, 10 August 2008 (UTC) [reply]

• Comment I'm not questioning whether or not the tour exists. Rather, I'm questioning the notability of the tour itself. The article is little more than just a list of dates, and the tour itself doesn't seem to be too notable. Rwiggum (^Talk/_Contrib) 06:33, 10 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment Of course it’s notable. It was her first major headlining tour. I supplied more than enough information on this tour. Do you know how many other tours on wikipedia, that have way less information than this and are more up for notable clauses than this article ex: Headstrong_Tour_Across_America, Come_as_You_Are_Tour,Ms._Kelly_Tour (Prime Example)There are plenty more, that I just don’t feel like searching for. And as I look around a lot of tours on wikipedia has just about everything this one has and looks just like this tour page. What makes those tours different from this one?

Simply being her first tour does not make it notable, and Other stuff exists is not a valid defense. The tour itself is not notable. Rwiggum (^Talk/_Contrib) 07:10, 10 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment And who died, and made you the decision maker of what's notable and what's not? — Preceding unsigned comment added by ravenfan4ever (talk • contribs)

• Comment Nobody died, and I'm not the decision maker. Rather, it would help if you read WP:MUSIC to get an idea of wikipedia's guidelines for music notability. Also, WP:OUTCOMES#MUSIC deals more specifically with tours. The thing is, there isn't enough information to get this article to grow very far beyond a stub, and the tour itself just wasn't notable enough. Rwiggum (^Talk/_Contrib) 07:19, 10 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Raven-Symoné: Live in Concert Tour added. Rwiggum (^Talk/_Contrib) 07:24, 10 August 2008 (UTC) [reply]

well, were just gonna have to wait and see what everyone else thinks. And if it gets deleted, hey.. I was wrong I'm not here to start no arguement I am way to grown for that. I just feel its something that needs to be mentioned and I dont find your reasons enough reason for deleting as well as you dont find my reasons enough for keeping

• STRONGEST DELETEper nom. The nominator has expressed everything although I think CsD would have done the job. H2H (talk) 07:36, 10 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete the lot. The few references supplied show the tours exist, but not how they are even remotely notable.  Esradekan Gibb  ^"Talk" 08:52, 10 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• STRONG KEEP I agree with the creator, this page as well as the Raven-Symone Live page should be kept. I think both tour are notable. The This Is My Time was a sold-out tour I have to look for the link but Raven deff said every date sold out (that shows finacial), both Raven tours are refrenced, idk about relationship to audience but I know that all of Raven's both tour has gotten GREAT reviews and I have sources for that. And I dont care about the other stuff exist excuse because its just not fair that these tours get singled out wen over 3/4 of all tours on wikipedia look like these so if your gonna nominate these tours for deletetion you need to held over to the Category:Concert_tours of wikipedia and get busy. Why is it always like a prison guard watching over the RS section that makes sure nothing new gets posted on the oh so highly respected, always reliable and creditable wikipedia (LMAO) no one references wikipedia. SO to just pick these tours is real dumb of you and i bet half of the tours you may edit look just like this. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Raheemistheone (talk • contribs) Note: This user's only edits are for this AfD page. Rwiggum (^Talk/_Contrib) 06:59, 14 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• If you notice, I also nominated the other tours mentioned, not just Raven Symone's tour pages. It is my feeling that a great deal of the tour pages on Wikipedia are not notable, even if the artists are. There just isn't much to say about them other than posting a tour schedule and setlist, which isn't encyclopedic. If you will, take a look at the AfD discussions for some of the other tour pages I've nominated to get an idea of the arguments against these pages. Change for Change Tour, Love on the Inside Tour. And if you want to know what a notable tour article looks like, take a look at the Soul2Soul II Tour page. I originally nominated it for deletion, but after some discussion, I helped re-write and organize the article to contain more substantial content. Honestly though, that was an absolutely record-breaking tour, and I don't think that Raven Symone's tours can begin to compare to the kind of precedent set by the Soul2Soul tours. Rwiggum (^Talk/_Contrib) 18:18, 10 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete There is some precedent (including AfDs referenced in that one) that tours are not notable nd this one does not appear to be any different. No one is doubting these tours happened, just that they aren't encyclopedically notable. TravellingCari 23:52, 10 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete them all They fail WP:N and WP:RS. Undeath (talk) 05:10, 11 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete. Not even notable enough to argue about. Dayewalker (talk) 07:50, 12 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep I think the Raven-Symone Live Tour should stay because that has plenty of reliable sources, and I believe its noteable, but I think the This Is My Time Tour can be deleted because it's so old and there's really no need for it, and the rest the Ashley one can be deleted that tour isnt even big enough for mentioning purposes plus it was a mall tour, and that nelly tour can be deleted b/c its a sloppy mess. If anything all these tours can be merged in the albums page, except the This Is My Time tour that can be deleted all together —Preceding unsigned comment added by Rscp123 (talk • contribs) 17:26, 12 August 2008 (UTC) [reply]

  Comment. This was the first edit for Rscp123. Dayewalker (talk) 19:07, 12 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Looks like we need a checkuser for that one. My bet is it's a sock of ravenfan trying to tally up keep votes. Undeath (talk) 22:49, 12 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep RS:LICT article is very notable and worth remaining on this site. You have not provide any proof that this tour is non-notable other than "just having information and tour dates". Raven is not a major artist thus, her tours are not going to get as much coverage as Miley Cyrus, etc. Within the market of which this tour is aimed at, its is getting significant coverage and has numerous reliable sources outside the artist's main website. This article does not meet any terms for deletion. Dancefloor royalty (talk) 14:45, 13 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment The problem is, I have shown why the article should not stay. There is a lack of significant content in the article. The article is unlikely to grow past a stub, and there simply isn't enough evidence that the TOUR is notable. It doesn't matter how notable the artist is, if the tour on it's own is not notable, then it fails to meet WP:N. Rwiggum (^Talk/_Contrib) 16:32, 13 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment Unfortunately, you have not provided adequate explanation as to why this tour is not notable beyond the fact that this article "may or may not" grow beyond a stub. No matter how you try to alter your words, you are still saying the same thing. Bottom line is when an artist goes on tour, its notable no matter how big or small. As stated before, the tour is not going to make the headlines because Raven is not a headline making artists. Thus, it will only make news in the demographic the tour is targeted to. There is siginicant content know and as the tour progress and either Raven herself, Hollywood Records or the various venues release more information, more information will be added to the article. That is how things work. You are not a fortune teller. You do not know how what lies for this tour. Dancefloor royalty (talk) 22:57, 14 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• I think that you just made several major arguments for deletion. For one, you say that if an artist goes on tour, then that tour is automatically notable. This could not be further from the truth. If you would actually READ WP:NOTINHERITED, you would see that any subject HAS to be notable on it's own, completely regardless of any relations it may have. In this case, the tour is not notable because Raven is notable, it must be notable in it's own right. Secondly, you said yourself that Raven is not a headline-making artist. Then why, pray tell, is her tour notable enough for it's own article? Third, you say that while there isn't much significant content now, more content may be added in the future. This is a textbook case of crystalballing if I've ever seen one. An article has to be notable now. An article cannot be kept purely on speculation that it may become more notable in the future. Let me know if you have any more questions. Rwiggum (^Talk/_Contrib) 23:48, 14 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment I have struck both comments by the sock puppeteer and the sock puppet. Undeath (talk) 15:03, 13 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep This tour really existed abd exist on Wikipedia articles about others tour with only tour dates and nothing more.Voices4ever (talk) 21:16, 13 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• What? I can't understand what you're trying to say. Also, just because other stuff exists, that is not a valid reason for keeping this article. Rwiggum (^Talk/_Contrib) 01:04, 14 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Note: This debate has been included in the list of Music-related deletion discussions. -- Fabrictramp | talk to me 00:23, 14 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.