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Hello all! What constitutes a launch as a failure for the purposes of this article? Should this context be added to the article to give better clarification of why some may call launches a failure while others call them a success? Macota99 (talk) 09:12, 25 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

If you want to know editors' rationale for each decision, be prepared for some book-length reading. The decisions were not made lightly and will not be changed. You can find the discussions in the archives of Talk:SpaceX Starship (the links are in the box at the top).

We could try to put a section in explaining it, but I suspect it would be futile to try to boil the decisions down to a sentence or two that all the editors would agree with. Fortunately, success/failure should be less contentious going forward, once payloads are being flown. Narnianknight (talk) 12:54, 25 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

To sumarize (so that you don't have to wade through ten articles of arguments):

(EDIT: Changed Orbit to Trajectory, as IFT-3 through IFT-5 were suborbital -Redacted II)

Destruction of vehicle means failure. This includes FTS (see IFT-2)

Failure to reach orbit the intended trajectory means failure.

Reaching a usable orbit trajectory, but not the desired one, is a partial failure.

Success is right orbit if the vehicle reaches the intended trajectory.

So, launch success is determined (for these cargoless flights) at the moment of SECO. Redacted II (talk) 22:41, 25 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

And to be clear, "orbit" here means intended trajectory. Narnianknight (talk) 13:27, 26 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, my bad. Redacted II (talk) 15:23, 26 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, "orbit" is a funky term. The IFT-3 through -6 vehicles, along with presumably IFT-7 in the new year (right? 2 didn't make it, but 3 did? I can't remember lol) reached orbital velocity, but didn't complete a full orbit around the earth, instead being in a sub-orbital trajectory while at orbital velocity. (This stuff is weird. Orbital mechanics is weird. How did we figure this out, as a species? Just, in general. Ignore this in future replies, I'm just rambling.) IFT-8 is supposedly going to be the first one to attempt catching the Starship upper stage (at least, according to Elon), so that'll be the first one to presumably go for the full orbital insertion. XFalcon2004x (talk) 20:47, 3 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]