Welcome!

Hello, Robert of Ramsor, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:

• The five pillars of Wikipedia
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I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your messages on discussion pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically insert your username and the date. If you need help, check out Wikipedia:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or ask your question and then place {{helpme}} before the question on your talk page. Again, welcome! --Flex (talk/contribs) 05:26, 26 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for the welcome and links to the Tutorial etc. I originally logged on since I felt that contributions as large as I was making (I have added 2 paragraphs to the Hugh Bourne article) were better done by someone who did not remain anonymous. I have some interest in Methodist history, and was pleasantly surprised to find that the originator (presumably) of this article had linked to a biography of Bourne which I posted some years ago on my web site. My original choice of user name was already taken, and I thought that this one would probably be unique. I have Methodist ancestors from Ramsor, Staffordshire, and it is one of the significant places in Primitive Methodist history.

I looked at your Talk Page, and found so many posts I thought it best to reply to you here. As far as I can see, the only means of posting in this way is to use the Edit Page option, which also means learning the peculiarities of the Wiki codes for formatting. I will now add the 4 tildes and see if it works for me.

Robert of Ramsor (talk) 23:46, 26 February 2008 (UTC) Using the Preview option, I see that it has added my signature.[reply]

Again, welcome. If I can help you, feel free to ask on my talk page (don't bother about it being lost -- I get messages when someone posts there). --Flex (talk/contribs) 02:44, 29 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Hello Robert of Ramsor! Welcome to Wikiproject Christianity! Thank you for joining. Below are some useful links to facilitate your involvement. Happy editing! - Tinucherian (talk) 02:25, 3 March 2008 (UTC) [reply] Getting Started General • Task for You Wikiproject Talk Page • Templates Useful Links Project Category List of Christian Topics Christianity Portal Miscellaneous Featured Articles • Good Articles Did You Know? • Work Groups Anabaptist • Core Topics • Indian Christianity Iglesia ni Cristo • Jesus • Syriac Christianity Projects Article Requests • Destubbing Campaign Assessment • Articles Needing Clean-up Peer Review • Adopted Topics Similar WikiProjects Anglicanism • Bible • Calvinism Roman Catholicism • Lutheranism

On 4 March, 2008, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article H B Kendall, which you created or substantially expanded. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

On 4 March, 2008, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Ramsor, which you created or substantially expanded. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

--Maxim_(talk) 21:15, 4 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Hello. Take a look at my recent edits to Methodist Union. Wikipedia:Manual of Style calls for fairly sparing use of capital letters in section headings. Thus "See also" and "External links", with lower-case "a" and lower-case "l", are correct. In the case of "Hymn Book" I decided it could be considered an abbreviation of the book title, so I left the "B" as capital, but since book titles are to be italicized, I set that section heading in italics. Michael Hardy (talk) 21:35, 4 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I think the best way to proceed with a possible Methodism group would be to list one on the Wikipedia:WikiProject Council/Proposals page, and see if it gets sufficient interest. The proposal is now listed at Wikipedia:WikiProject Council/Proposals#Methodism. My guess is it will garner enough interest.

Regarding the changes to the articles, I think what you're basically talking about is to set up those sections in accord with Wikipedia:Summary style, which is something we would all clearly have no objections to. Whether they would be necessarily be identical in both articles is possibly questioinable, but the idea is definitely in accord with wikipedia editing guidelines. John Carter (talk) 15:16, 6 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

This might interest you - Tinucherian (talk) 17:34, 6 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

This is what I posted on the Methodism article Discussion page about my Difference between arminianism and calvinism. I have copied it here in case anyone wants to discuss this on my Talk rather than the wider Methodism pages.

Please note that this needs moving (later, when the whole article is further revised) from the Lead section to one on Beliefs in the article body, since the Lead is too long. I hope to work on this in April to cut down the number of words in the Lead.

I have changed back to what I said on the distinction between arminianism and calvinism for the following reasons.

My original is

The primary difference is that Arminians interpret the Bible as teaching that the saving work of Jesus Christ is for all people (general atonement} but effective only to those who believe in accordance with the Reformation principles of Grace alone and Faith alone. Calvinists emphasize the deterministic interpretation of Election, that salvation is only for a few decreed by God (limited atonememt) while all others are decreed to be condemned.

end of extract.

A. Jacobus Arminius and John Wesley are fully within Reformation principles and thinking. Note that I did not say Reformed here, partly because some calvinists equate reformed with calvinist ignoring the wider strands of the Reformation. The principles known as the "4 Solas" (or 5 in some lists) are common ground between arminians and calvinists.

B. "Election to damnation" is one of the basic tenets of calvinism (though not part of the TULIP summary), as is "limited atonement". (I think it is the 1659 Particular Baptist Confession, I need to check when I get time.) On calvinist discussion web sites (example, Challies), some refer to unbelievers as "VOWFTD" - "vessels of wrath fitted to destruction". While I would not include this in a Wikipedia article, it can be found by anyone looking at these discussions.

C. As an engineer by training, I see the calvinistic emphasis on the decrees of God from the beginning of eternity as being deterministic, hence including the term.

I therefore maintain that my original (accepting with thanks the edit by KitHutch) is an accurate and factual description and I therefore stand by it as according with Wikipedia principles. But there may be a case for inserting a note that calvinists also accept the Solas.

Robert of Ramsor (talk) 19:03, 10 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Correction - Baptist Confession is 1689 not 1659. Anyone who reads Section 3, on God's Decree, cannot fail to see either determinism or election to damnation. By way of example, young Andrew Fuller (1754-1815) scandalised the society of Soham Baptist Church for rebuking a fellow member for drunkenness; the pastor excused Fuller for his youth, and argued responsibility for keeping from open sins, and was forced to resign; the man admonished by Fuller "smelt ... the Arminian heresy that a man could be his own keeper in matters of conduct." (Griffiths, "A pocket History of the Baptist Movement", p.109) Yet calvinist Paul Washer is preaching this "arminian heresy" of holy living as vigorously as John Wesley. (I am giving reference for my original statement, not advocating a doctrine.) I need to add the 1689 Confession as a reference to the Methodism article. Robert of Ramsor (talk) 20:05, 10 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Wikipedia is (or so I understand) not the place to debate issues of doctrine in great detail. But I think it is allowed to debate references to primary material to authenticate particulars (no pun on calvinistic baptists intended) in articles. BTW, I find that I have contributed 11 references on the numbered list of 20, just on my revision of the Lead section alone. Robert of Ramsor (talk) 21:26, 10 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

The Christianity WikiProject Newsletter

The Christianity WikiProject Newsletter! Issue IV - April 2008 Monthly Challenge: Article News Go on over to Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Christianity. A lot is going on and your input is needed! Look over the recent changes list for recent improvements to articles, other changes and vandalism. Articles needing improvement can be found in Category:Christianity stubs. Twenty four articles are at FA level and Forty four are GA level articles. You can help by adopting a topic. Christianity Articles by Quality Make visible or invisible by clicking Show or Hide, respectively. Project News WikiProject Christianity Coordinators : The project coordinators are generally responsible for maintaining all of the procedural and administrative aspects of the project, and serve as the designated points-of-contact for procedural issues. They are not, however, endowed with any special executive powers, nor with any authority over article content or editor conduct.The Lead Coordinator bears overall responsibility for coordinating the project; the Assistant Coordinators aid the Lead Coordinator and focus on specific areas that require special attention. The nomination period for coordinators is currently ongoing at Election 2008 Nominations for open positions will be open through 23:59 (UTC) on April 30 and project members should vote for any candidates they support by April 11 2008. The election will be conducted using simple approval voting. Any member of the project may support as many of the candidates as they wish. The candidate with the highest number of endorsements will become the Lead Coordinator (provided he or she is willing to assume the post); the next four candidates will become Coordinators. Two new workgroups formed - Indian Christianity and Methodism Portal:Indian Christianity launched. Member News Our membership continues to expand. It is currently at 184 users. 86 new users have joined the WikiProject since last issue. Please make them feel welcomed! Archives of previous newsletters can be found here. To stop receiving this newsletter, or to receive it in a different format, add your name here. If you have any news or any announcements to be broadcast, let ~ Tinucherian know. This newsletter is automatically delivered by GrooveBot.

BetacommandBot (talk) 00:03, 8 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

The Christianity WikiProject Newsletter

The Christianity WikiProject Newsletter! Issue V - May 2008 Article News 49 ( earlier 24) articles are at FA level and 94 (Earlier 44) are GA level articles. You can help by adopting a topic. Articles needing improvement can be found in Category:Christianity stubs. Project News Go on over to Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Christianity. A lot is going on and your input is needed! Look over the recent changes list for recent improvements to articles, other changes and vandalism. WikiProject Christianity Coordinators : The project coordinators are generally responsible for maintaining all of the procedural and administrative aspects of the project, and serve as the designated points-of-contact for procedural issues. They are not, however, endowed with any special executive powers, nor with any authority over article content or editor conduct.The Lead Coordinator bears overall responsibility for coordinating the project; the Assistant Coordinators aid the Lead Coordinator and focus on specific areas that require special attention. The following Coordinators were elected after Elections 2008 Lead Coordinator : John Carter Assistant Coordinators : Tinucherian and Secisek Congratulations to the newly elected Project Coordinators. It has been proposed that Wikipedia:WikiProject Serbian Orthodox Church be merged into Wikipedia:WikiProject Eastern Orthodoxy. All opinions are welcome. One new workgroup was formed - Christianity in China Portal:Christianity in China was launched. Portal:Indian Christianity was renamed to Portal:Christianity in India Wikipedia:WikiProject Indian Christianity was renamed to Christianity in India Work Group There is also a discussion regarding whether any new subportals dealing with Christianity should be created here. All inputs are welcome. Bot Assisted Assessment was used for the unassessed project articles. Should you need any manual reassessment , kindly request it here. Member News Our membership continues to expand. It is currently at 223 users. 39 new users have joined the WikiProject in the month of April 2008. Please make them feel welcomed! Christianity Articles by Quality Make visible or invisible by clicking Show or Hide, respectively. To do list of the Project Make visible or invisible by clicking Show or Hide, respectively. Here are some tasks awaiting attention: Article requests : Abundant Living Christian Fellowship; African Universal Church; Alpha and Omega Christian Church and Bible School; Altar Fellowship; American Catholic Church, Archdiocese of New York; American Christian Commission; American Missiology Society; American Mission for Opening Churches; Antiochan Orthodox Christian Archdiocese of Mexico; Apostolic Faith (Hawaii); Apostolic Faith (Kansas); Apostolic Faith Bible College; Asian-American Protestants; Assemblies of Yahweh (Michigan); Assembly of the Called Out Ones of Yah; Assembly of Yahvah (Alabama); Assembly of Yahvah (Oregon); Associated Churches of God; Association of Fundamental Gospel Churches; Association of Seventh Day Pentecostal Assemblies; Association of United Baptists (Green River, Kentucky); Banner Herald (Progressive); Baptist Missionary Association; Barefoot Ministries; Benjamin Fay Mills; Berean Bible Society; Bible Holiness Movement; Bible Protestant Church; California Evangelistic Association; Calvary Ministries, Inc.; Christian Holiness Association; Christian Identity Church (currently a redirect); Christian Millenial Church; Christianity and the American Revolution; Christ's Church (Mormon); Church of Antioch (Liberal Catholic); Church of Christ (Holiness); Church of Christian Liberty; Church of God Evangelistic Association; Church of God (Jerusalem Acres); Church of God of the Mountain Assembly; Church of God (Sanctified Church); Church of God (Seventh-Day, Salem, West Virginia); Church of God (World Headquarters); Church of the Bible Covenant; Church of the Living God (Christian Workers for Fellowship); Church of the Living God, the Pillar and Ground of Truth; Church of the Trinity (Invisible Ministry); Churches of God (Independent Holiness People); Community of the Love of Christ (Evangelical Catholic); Congregational Bible Church; Davis Swing; Defenders of the Faith (page currently is for a Judas Priest album); Deliverance Evangelical Centers; Divine Science Federation International; Edward Scribner Ames; Emmanuel Association; Emmanuel Holiness Church; Emmanuel's Fellowship; Evangelical Friends Alliance; Evangelical Friends Church, Eastern Region; Evangelical Mennonite Brethren Church; Evangelical Methodist Church of America; Evangelical Orthodox (Catholic) Church; Federation for Authentic Lutheranism; Federation of St. Thomas Christian Churches; Forked Deer Association (Regular); Frank Nathan Daniel Buckman; Free Church of Berkeley; Free Will Baptist Church of the Pentecostal Faith; Friends United Meeting - Western Yearly Meeting; Full Gospel Minister Association; Fundamental Fellowship; General Conference of the Evangelical Baptist Church; General Council of the Churches of God; Gospel Assemblies (Sowder); Gospel Mission Corps; Grace and Hope Mission; Grace Gospel Fellowship; Herbert Lockwood Willett; Holiness Christian Church (currently a redirect); Holiness Today; Holy Synod in Resistance; House of Prayer for All People; Hungarian Reformed Church; Independent Assemblies of God International; 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New Order of Glastonbury; North American Old Roman Catholic Church; Ohio Bible Church; Old Catholic Church (Hamel), Congregation of St. Paul; Old Catholic Church in America; Old Holy Catholic Church, Province of North America; Oriental Missionary Society Holiness Conference of North America; Orthodox Church of Canada - Orthodox Church of the New World (USA); Pacific Yearly Meeting; Pan African Orthodox Christian Church; Pentecostal Church of Zion; Pentecostal Fire-Baptized Holiness Church; Phoenix Institute (Church of Man); Prophetic Bible Conference of 1914; Prophetic Herald Ministry; Renaissance Church of Beauty; Rocky Mountain Yearly Meeting; Seventh Day Baptist General Conference; Seventh Day Church of God; Soldiers of the Cross of Christ; Sons Ahman Israel; Sucarnochee River (Mississippi) Association (Black); Sudat School Ministries; Syro-Chaldean Church of North America; Tayu Fellowship; True Church of Christ, Restored (Roberts); Union Association of Regular Baptist Churches; Union of Spiritual Communities of Christ; United Church of Jesus Christ (Apostolic); United Church of Religious Science (currently a redirect to a list); United Evangelical Churches; Universal Christian Spiritual Faith and Churches for All Nations (National David Spiritual Temple); Universal Industrial Church of the New World Comforter (One World Commune); Universal Peace Mission Movement; Upper Country Line (North Carolina) Association (Predestinarian); Walter Scott (Disciples of Christ); Wesleyan Tabernacle Association; Wesleyan Tabernacle Association of Churches; Youth in Mission; Cleanup : Christendom; Connexion; Crossley Hospital; Georgia District Church of the Nazarene; Holiness movement; Hyperdispensationalism; Lord's Day; Pablo Salazar Mendiguchia; Primitive Methodism; World Day of Prayer; Copyedit : All Saints Church, West Dulwich, Asia-Pacific Nazarene Theological Seminary; Blessed Virgin Mary; Christian mysticism in ancient Africa; Fresh Expressions; Nazarene Caravan; Sacraments of Initiation; Soul; The Gift of God; Expand : Apocalypticism; Christianity in the Middle East; Conservative Evangelicalism; History of Calvinism Merge : Atonement (governmental view); Christian Church; Christian perfection; Christianity by country; Eucharistic discipline; Oecumene; Open communion; Religions by country; Sinless perfection; NPOV : Bill Gothard; Christian Hebraist; Christian terrorism; List of Eastern Orthodox jurisdictions in North America; Mary Baker Eddy; Semi-Arianism Update : Calvinistic Methodists; Karl Ullmann Verify : Albert Outler; All Saints Church, West Dulwich; Antinomianism; Apocalypticism; Asbury College; Asia-Pacific Nazarene Theological Seminary; Awesome God; Catholic; Christendom; Christian; Christian counseling; Christian Science; Christian terrorism; Christianity in the Middle East; Christmas Conference (Methodism); Church; Church architecture; Connexion (religion); Darrel R. 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Prince; World Day of Prayer; Nazarene Missionaries; Other : Stanley Rader; Christian mysticism in ancient Africa; Consecration; NYUK; Phoebe Palmer; Sacrament; Sanctification; Seneca Falls Convention; Thomas Jay Oord; World Day of Prayer; Family Radio; Biblical hermeneutics; Second Council of Ephesus/Robber Synod; Archives of previous newsletters can be found here. To stop receiving this newsletter, or to receive it in a different format, add your name here. If you have any news or any announcements to be broadcast, let ~ The Newsletter Editors know. This newsletter is automatically delivered by Addbot (talk) 15:38, 15 May 2008 (UTC) .[reply]

The Christianity WikiProject Newsletter

Archives  |  Tip Line  |  Editors The Christianity WikiProject Newsletter Issue VI - June 2008 Project news We now have 51 featured articles and 98 good articles, with the recent promotions of Hubert Walter to FA class, and Oswald of Worcester, Papal election, 1292-1294, Pontius Pilate's wife, and Towson United Methodist Church to GA level. Thanks to all those who worked on these articles! Member news The project currently has 233 members, 15 joined & 1 leavers since the start of May 2008. Other news Roman Catholic Church is currently a featured article candidate. Bath Abbey has been nominated for GA status. Related projects news New Projects and/or work groups have been proposed for Christian theology and Christian denomations. Christianity related news Barack Obama leaves Trinity United Church Court ruling on FLDS case From the Members Welcome to the Sixth issue of the WikiProject Christianity newsletter! Use this newsletter as a mechanism to inform yourselves about progress at the project and please be inspired to take more active roles in what we do. Luckily, you all won't have to see my comments very often, as very little I have to say is really that important. But I would like to take the opportunity to say that I hope everyone finds the new General Forum page useful for discussing ideas relevant to Christianity in general, and feels free to make any additional comments regarding general Christianity there. Also, if any of you feel that you want to place a comment here in the future, please let us know what you want included. We would encourage all members to get more involved and if you are wondering what with, please ask. Use this newsletter as a mechanism to inform yourselves about progress at the project and please be inspired to take more active roles in what we do. John Carter (talk), Lead Coordinator Newsletter challenge We are initiating a new feature here. Every month, we will list one misisng article. The first person to start the article will be mentioned by name in the next newsletter, as well as any others should they help get included in the Main Page DYK's section. This month's article is Church of Daniel's Band. To stop receiving this newsletter, or to receive it in a different format, please list yourself in the appropriate section here. This newsletter is automatically delivered by TinucherianBot (talk) 09:01, 9 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

The Christianity WikiProject Newsletter

Archives  |  Tip Line  |  Editors The Christianity WikiProject Newsletter Issue VIII - July 2008 Project news We now have 53 featured articles 6 featured lists, and 130 good articles, with the recent promotions of Thomas Cranmer to FA class, List of encyclicals of Pope John XXIII to FL status, and Hugh de Puiset to GA level. Thanks to all those who worked on these articles! Portal:Lutheranism has been created, and other portals are being discussed. Please feel free to take part in the discussion at Wikipedia:WikiProject Christianity/General Forum. Member news The project currently has 239 members, 10 joined & 1 leavers since the start of June 2008. Other news Thomas S. Monson is currently a Good Article nominee. Related projects news New Projects and/or work groups have been proposed for Christian theology and Christian denomations. Christianity related news Former science director sues Texas over intelligent design e-mail Mormon church warns Wikileaks over documents From the Members Welcome to the Eighth issue of the WikiProject Christianity newsletter! Use this newsletter as a mechanism to inform yourselves about progress at the project and please be inspired to take more active roles in what we do. As many of you will know, we currently have several articles relating to the same basic topics. The articles in the Category:Baptism are one example of such. It is really in the interests of all of us to try to place as much content in the main article of such topics, and then have the other articles "branch off" from there and making the central article as good an article as possible. We also now have a proposal for a new general "Christianity" related award, similar to the Military history project's chevrons, at Wikipedia:WikiProject Christianity/General Forum. John Carter (talk), Lead Coordinator Newsletter challenge Last month's new article challenge, Church of Daniel's Band, was begun by User:Jack1956 and was included in the Main page's DYK section on June 15. Thank you to Jack1956 for his great work on creating this article! This month's article is Amended Christadelphians. To stop receiving this newsletter, or to receive it in a different format, please list yourself in the appropriate section here.

This Newsletter was automatically delivered by TinucherianBot (talk) 08:59, 9 July 2008 (UTC) [reply]

Thanks for the heads up. I have made some edits to the article to bring it in line with WP:OVERLINK and MOS:SYL. By the way, the correct disambiguation for "English Civil War" is English Civil War. Regards, Ground Zero | t 02:11, 4 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for your comment on this (which I've moved by the way - by convention these usually go on the User Talk page not the User page). There are of course many of these '3 shires' places (there is one called Three Shires Stones near us, which I didn't know about until it started appearing on Tesco egg-boxes). Yes you're right about the Dove, but somehow Derbyshire always calls the shots on Peak District matters ('Some of the best bits of 'Derbyshire' are in Staffordshire'... and under the Maud report on local governement of the early 70s nearly where in reality :-)). Bob aka Linuxlad (talk) 08:28, 14 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Pass, I've not got involved in Co ordinates and the maps yet. I'd seen the comment about it not liking boundaries on the talk page. Did not get what you mean about it showing Edinburgh at first but i see what you mean on the Hollinsclough map about it goeing a bit out. I'll copy question over to Keith D on the Yorkshire project and see if he can help or point out an expert. - BulldozerD11 (talk) 00:53, 16 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I am new to contributing to Wikki and not au fait with its netiquette and nuances [so I hope I am posting this right]. I have been researching the KENDALL family for about 25+ years [I am a descendant]. I have extensive knowledge and collected vast amounts of data for them. Which I am using in a book I am currently writing on them and this takes all of my free time at the minute.

As a family historian I know there was no standardisation of spellings of names [you have noted this]. Bickerstaff can indeed be spelt with or without an 'e', in my own documentation for the family the spelling switches between both. However from family knowledge [I am in touch with several of HBK'S descendants] and some of the documentation I have; we know Holliday went by the name of H. Bickerstaffe Kendall and not H.B. Kendall [his descendants also use the 'e']. A biography in the Aldersgate Magazine p396-397 1919; the Primitive Methodist Magazine of 1900 p723-4; the PM minutes 1919 p274, Who Was Who vol II (1916-1928)and the book Ministers and Probationers with circuits etc 1963 [Martin & Sheldon] and his gravestone; all use H. Bickerstaffe Kendall. In his will he uses his full name; again with addition of an 'e'. So for the sake of continuity I have used Bickerstaffe with an 'e' in my research. There is also an online portrait for him in the New York Public Library Digital Archive which also uses the 'e'.

http://digitalgallery.nypl.org/nypldigital/dgkeysearchdetail.cfm?trg=1&strucID=1024727&imageID=1547720&parent_id=1023696&word=&snum=&s=&notword=&d=&c=&f=&sScope=&sLevel=&sLabel=&total=1&num=0&imgs=12&pNum=&pos=1

Whilst I agree William Leary is an excellent staring point for Methodism [he helped me immensely after personal contact in starting my book] My research into Methodism has shown there are discrepancies and errors in his works [just like HBK and probably mine]. Leary's "Directory of Primitive Methodist Ministers and their Circuits" is a secondary source. Leary may have made the errors in transcription or the anomaly comes from the original document(s) for the missing 'e'.

I am not sure what you mean in this sentence "Bickerstaff is NOT listed in Leary, so was not a Primitive Methodist Minister."

I was very pleased to see your addition to Wikki for HBK. At long last an opportunity for his story to be told. You asked for contributions and sources to this entry which I have duly supplied. I would love to add more but have no idea how to upload images and it is all still a steep learning curve for me. My main priority at the minute is completion of my book and so I do not have the time to devote to Wikki at the moment. Ironically my final chapter is that of HBK. Today I have been to take photographs of William Clowes and other noteworthy PM's of Hull headstones [what a sorry sight it was](MBorrill (talk) 21:44, 26 October 2008 (UTC))[reply]

I found the Wikipedia article while preparing for the anniversary of a General Baptist church which split off from a Particular Baptist church in 1833. A personal viewpoint here. The number of hymns celebrating Election seems to me to show a distortion, by taking one small point and magnifying it out of all proportion. Which is how error starts. (I will probably have many of the calvinists after me like a Synod of Dortrecht.) A couple of William Gadsby's very good hymns are used in the book Christian Hymns (Evangelical Movement of Wales, Bryntirion Press), and I quoted one of these in my sermon. But I have to look to Wesley for a truer understanding of such doctrine as Election. Thank God for those who have continued to bring received doctrine into line with what the Bible has to say. Robert of Ramsor (talk) 15:34, 7 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I just redirected the article Joseph Chance to Chance Brothers. In case you want to keep some of the content for the article Chance Brothers, here it is:
Joseph Chance gave his name to a glass manufacturing company which was one of the largest such companies in 19th century Britain. The Chance Glassworks was located in the industrial area between Smethwick and Oldbury in the Black Country. This site is now bisected by the M5 motorway betweens junctions 1 and 2, where two of the ornate buidings make prominent landmarks. The southern section of the glassworks site is now an industrial estate whose origins are commemorated in the road name Crystal Drive. One of the many significant products of the Chance Glassworks was the Fresnel lens pieces for lighthouses. --Afluegel (talk) 21:03, 21 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for your comments on my talk page. I am also looking forward to the contributions of your friend.--Afluegel (talk) 16:49, 22 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The Christianity WikiProject Newsletter

Archives  |  Tip Line  |  Editors The Christianity WikiProject Newsletter Issue VII - April 2009 Project news The Christianity project and its related projects currently have 65 FAs, 7 FLs, and 146 GAs. That is a wonderful number, particularly of the GAs. Thanks to all those who worked on these articles! Secisek was interviewed by the Wikipedia Signpost in their 9 March 2009 issue here. Thank you for your great work in getting more attention to the project! Member news Our membership continues to expand. We are currently at a stunning 278 registered members. A profound thank you to all of you. Without your support and work, this project, and wikipedia itself, would not exist. Other news We have recently started a separate subpage of the project dedicated to keeping the members informed of the latest activities regarding FA and GA status, requests for peer review and comment, proposed deletions, and other article related activity. That information can be found at Wikipedia:WikiProject Christianity/Article alerts. Please feel free to look at the page frequently and respond to any and all items posted there that you wish. Related projects news The Iglesia ni Cristo work group, Syriac Christianity work group, and Oriental Orthodoxy project are all currently being considered for restructuring. Any and all members of any of those groups are welcomed and encouraged to take part in the discussions. Christianity related news Pennsylvania Amish farmer jailed for outhouse violations Obama expands Bush's faith-based initiatives Relics of 39 saints found by British Museum From the Members Welcome to the Seventh, admittedly delayed, issue of the WikiProject Christianity newsletter! Use this newsletter as a mechanism to inform yourselves about progress at the project and please be inspired to take more active roles in what we do. Yes, it's been more than a bit of a rough time for some of us, okay, me, for a while here. Several things, most of them not real pleasant, kept coming up. I think most of that is over with know. I hope and pray as much anyway. Easter is the church's time of rebirth, and I hope it's a good time for the rebirth of this newsletter. I hope that the project grows in numbers and effectiveness as the church itself has over the years. Thanks again for all your efforts to date. Oh, yes, and please note that this section is entitled "From the Members". That means you, all of you. If any of you have any comments you'd like to share with the other members in this section, please feel free to let us know, and we'll put them in the next issue. We would encourage all members to get more involved and if you are wondering what with, please ask. Use this newsletter as a mechanism to inform yourselves about progress at the project and please be inspired to take more active roles in what we do. Thanks again. John Carter (talk), Lead Coordinator To stop receiving this newsletter, or to receive it in a different format, please list yourself in the appropriate section here. This newsletter is automatically delivered by TinucherianBot (talk) 04:40, 10 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The Christianity WikiProject Newsletter

Archives  |  Tip Line  |  Editors The Christianity WikiProject Newsletter Issue VIII - May 2009 Project news The Christianity project and its related projects currently have 68 FAs, 7 FLs, and 146 GAs, which includes 3 more FAs. We did however lose one FL and 2 GAs over the past month, but we still basically broke even with the 3 new FAs. Member news With the additions of cindyrom4jesus at 69.254.33.66, User:Jwhosler, and User:Arverniking, we now have 281 listed members. Thanks to you all, and a special welcome to our new members! Other news There is some new discussion regarding project related activities, specifically including the various Christianity portals, at Wikipedia:WikiProject Christianity/General Forum and the possible expansion of the extant Narnia task force of WikiProject Novels. All input is more than welcome. . Related projects news The WikiProject Films has recently created a new task force for Christian films. All interested parties are welcome to join and contribute. Member contest of the month Anyone who can bring any of the few Stub class articles among the project's 1000 most often accessed articles by the end of the month will get an award. Please see the details Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Christianity#Project challenge of the month. Christianity related news Pennsylvania Amish farmer jailed for outhouse violations Obama expands Bush's faith-based initiatives Relics of 39 saints found by British Museum From the Members Welcome to the Eighth issue of the WikiProject Christianity newsletter! Use this newsletter as a mechanism to inform yourselves about progress at the project and please be inspired to take more active roles in what we do. Hello from the new Christian films task force! I was recently apart of founding a task force, so this is the story. For several months, I would not only contribute to Christian films, groups, etc., but I'd also see other users working on similar articles. I really wanted to create a project for us to work from. Filmcom contacted me about trying to get a task force going, so we began working together on it. When it appeared the idea was dying, we continued to fight, and several other users joined! Thanks to the efforts of many users, I'd like to introduce you to the Christian films task force! We are currently having a bot tag all Christian film-related articles, and we are working to define our project scope. We now have our own icon and shortcut (WP:CFTF), with ten users signed out thus far - these are just some of the things that have been happening in the last few days. If you have any interest in joining such a project, we welcome everyone to join and get involved. American Eagle (talk) To stop receiving this newsletter, or to receive it in a different format, please list yourself in the appropriate section here. This newsletter is automatically delivered by TinucherianBot (talk) 14:34, 11 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The Christianity WikiProject Newsletter

Archives  |  Tip Line  |  Editors The Christianity WikiProject Newsletter Issue IX - June 2009 Project news The Christianity project and its related projects currently have 72 FAs, 6 FLs, and 145 GAs, which includes 4 more FAs. We did however lose one FL and 1 GAs over the past month, but we still gained overall. Member news It was a big month for new members, with User:SixGreenFish, User:Invmog, User:Unconsumed, User:TheThankful, User:Noghiri, and User:1111tomica joining, bringing us up to 286 listed members. Thanks to you all, and a special welcome to our new members! Other news There is some new discussion regarding project related activities, specifically including the various Christianity portals, at Wikipedia:WikiProject Christianity/General Forum and the possible expansion of the extant Narnia task force of WikiProject Novels. All input is more than welcome. . Related projects news The WikiProject Films has recently created a new task force for Christian films. All interested parties are welcome to join and contribute. Member contest of the month Given the lateness of the newsletter last month, the contest from last month continues. Anyone who can bring any of the few Stub class articles among the project's 1000 most often accessed articles by the end of June will get an award. Please see the details Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Christianity#Project challenge of the month. Christianity related news Pennsylvania Amish farmer jailed for outhouse violations Obama expands Bush's faith-based initiatives Relics of 39 saints found by British Museum From the Members Welcome to the Ninth issue of the WikiProject Christianity newsletter! Use this newsletter as a mechanism to inform yourselves about progress at the project and please be inspired to take more active roles in what we do. I am in the process of going through the various categories related to Christianity. I am finding that several of them may not have sufficient number of members to continue. By the end of the month, I hope to have the main category list finished (yeah, it might take that long, it's huge). At that time, I think we will review all the categories and see which may not have sufficient articles to continue. Please feel free to take part in the discussion regading what the minimum number of category items is, and how to deal with the non-qualifying categories, on the General Forum page. John Carter (talk) 23:26, 1 June 2009 (UTC)[reply] To stop receiving this newsletter, or to receive it in a different format, please list yourself in the appropriate section here. This newsletter is automatically delivered by -- Tinu Cherian - 13:25, 4 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The Christianity WikiProject Newsletter

Archives  |  Tip Line  |  Editors The Christianity WikiProject Newsletter Issue X - July 2009 Project news The Christianity project and its related projects currently have 76 FAs, 8 FLs, and 148 GAs. We gained new recognized content in each field, with 4 FAs promoted, 2 FLs, and 3 GAs. Congratulations and a big thank you to all those who worked on these articles! Member news It was a big month for new members, with User:RandomNumberSee, User:Per Ardua, User:Muzhogg, User:Arlen22, User:Scotchorama, and User:Jaybird vt joining, bringing us up to 292 listed members. Thanks to you all, and a special welcome to our new members! Other news I am still working on the categorization matter. With any luck, we should have some results by the end of the month. There are also some discussions regarding project related activities at Wikipedia:WikiProject Christianity/General Forum. One issue in particular that might be addressed is possible elections of new coordinators. Anyone interested in serving in such a capacity is more than welcome to indicate as much. Related projects news The WikiProject Films has recently created a new task force for Christian films. All interested parties are welcome to join and contribute. Member contest of the month The previous contests are still ongoing, because of the extreme amount of time the categorization is taking me. Anyone who can bring any of the few Stub class articles among the project's 1000 most often accessed articles by the end of July will get an award. Please see the details Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Christianity#Project challenge of the month. Christianity related news Pennsylvania Amish farmer jailed for outhouse violations Obama expands Bush's faith-based initiatives Relics of 39 saints found by British Museum From the Members Welcome to the Tenth issue of the WikiProject Christianity newsletter! Use this newsletter as a mechanism to inform yourselves about progress at the project and please be inspired to take more active roles in what we do. It has been a long time since the last coordinators election. There is a lot for people to do, and I certainly would welcome seeing any individuals with an interest in such a position put themselves forward as candidates. I in particular would very much like to see some degree of "specialization" in the coordinators, so that, for instance, we might have someone knowledgable about some of the specific Christian faith traditions or other main subjects, like Orthodoxy, Lutheranism, Mormonism, the Jehovah's Witnesses, art, theology, and so on. If any parties who have experience with some of our faith- or- subject-based content would be interested in being candidates, I would love to see them do so. Please feel free to take part in the discussion regading what the minimum number of category items is, and how to deal with the non-qualifying categories, on the General Forum page. John Carter (talk) 23:26, 1 July 2009 (UTC)[reply] To stop receiving this newsletter, or to receive it in a different format, please list yourself in the appropriate section here. This newsletter is automatically delivered by ~~~~

John Carter (talk) 22:48, 16 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The Christianity WikiProject Newsletter

Archives  |  Tip Line  |  Editors The Christianity WikiProject Newsletter Issue XI - August 2009 Project news The Christianity project and its related projects currently have 75 FAs, 8 FLs, and 147 GAs, with a net loss of one FA and one GA. Our thanks to those who helped keep some other articles listed, and to those who have worked so diligently in improving all of our articles. Member news Three new members joined this past month, including new members User:116Calvinist, User:Lrnngrbc, and User:Frazz, bringing us up to 295 listed members. Thanks to you all, and a special welcome to our new members! Other news Two new pages for the benefit of members of the project have been created. Wikipedia:WikiProject Christianity/Mutual aid society is designed to be a place where editors seeking specific assistance from other members can with luck find others who have the abilities or materials they need, and Wikipedia:WikiProject Christianity/Special collections is, at this point, the beginnings of a list of publicly accessible special collections libraries which our members might find useful. Anyone who lives near one of the collections listed is encouraged to visit them and see if they can find anything they would like to read or use to improve some of our articles. There are always some discussions regarding project related activities at Wikipedia:WikiProject Christianity/General Forum. I think the timing of the call for elections might have been bad (summer vacation, what was I thinking?), and have thus changed the period for individuals to run to be one of the project's coordinators. Individuals who have a particular interest or knowledge of specific fields within Christianity are encouraged to run, to serve as a kind of "unit coordinator" for that topic. Related projects news The WikiProject Films has recently created a new task force for Christian films. All interested parties are welcome to join and contribute. Christianity related news Pennsylvania Amish farmer jailed for outhouse violations Obama expands Bush's faith-based initiatives Relics of 39 saints found by British Museum From the Members Welcome to the Eleventh issue of the WikiProject Christianity newsletter! Use this newsletter as a mechanism to inform yourselves about progress at the project and please be inspired to take more active roles in what we do. One area in particular need of attention right now is the content related to the Oriental Orthodox churches. Several of the topics within this field are of great importance, including the churches themselves, their histories, thinking, and some of the individuals associated with it. Unfortunately, the number of people who belong to the churches, and, correspondingly, the number of editors working on that content, is smaller than it could be. Anyone interested in helping to develop this content is more than welcome to look at the Wikipedia:WikiProject Oriental Orthodoxy page and seeing where they can help out. John Carter (talk) 23:26, 1 July 2009 (UTC)[reply] To stop receiving this newsletter, or to receive it in a different format, please list yourself in the appropriate section here. This newsletter is automatically delivered by -- Tinu Cherian BOT - 19:36, 5 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The strength of Wikipedia, which is that it may be updated by anyone in the world, is its fatal flaw.

One of the rules of Wikipedia is that contributions must always be referenced back to another published source. In most cases, that earlier source is such that it may be regarded as authoritative for the subject matter of the article.

So when I wrote an article about the village of Peterstow (Herefordshire), as well as personal observation and my own photographs, I made extensive use of the Peterstow Millenium Book, which was written by the villagers for the year 2000. When suggesting that the Ivy Bush public house on the Hagley Road in Edgbaston was mentioned in The Lord of the Rings, I referenced this with the exact page in (my copy of) TLotR and a photo, plus the information that it is the closest pub to the Oratory which J R R Tolkien attended; there being no known published reference to this item.

The fatal flaw, Wikipedia's overwhelming weakness, is that in many cases it has been hijacked as a propoganda machine. So when I added a small note in the article on David Bellamy to the effect that his views on global warming had some support amongst scientists, my edit was immediately deleted by another editor who was a propogandist for the man-made global warming agenda. (My restoration has remained.)

I commonly hear comments about the factual unreliability of Wikipedia.

Now World Net Daily has highlighted how Wikipedia has been hijacked so that vital historical and scientific information has been erased from the record. A WND article, History of climate gets 'erased' online, details how a Wikipedia Adminstrator has fiddled the facts.

When Wikipedia Administrators falsify articles the reputation of Wikipedia as a trustworthy source of information lies in ruins.

-- Robert of Ramsor (talk) 00:11, 23 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I was about to ask one of the BBC WM presenters to look at this article to get the link to the Llanelwedd Arms Hotel. So I have sent her the link to the previous version. As far as I am concerned, the link I put in is not "spam", but part of the general encyclopaedic information about Llanelwedd. I would have like to say a lot more about this hotel, having found it to be one of the relatively few places to eat out wher you wish you lived near enough to go back there regularly. I restrained my contribution to mere encyclopaedic facts, rather than what could be counted as partisan advertising. -- Robert of Ramsor (talk) 09:13, 5 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Wikipedia is an encyclopedia and not the Michelin Guide or the AA Travel guide. Unless the hotel or any other premises is notable in the history or culture of location which is the focus of that article, then its inclusion is wholly questionable. See WP:NOT where it states that Wikipedia is not a travel guide. Unless you can justify it on grounds within an encyclopedic entry, then I or another editor will continue to remove it. Rgds, --Trident13 (talk) 09:20, 5 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Hello, I notice that you recently created a new page, National Association of Flower Aranging Societies. First, thank you for your contribution; Wikipedia relies solely on the efforts of volunteers such as you. Unfortunately, the page you created covers a topic on which we already have a page - National Association of Flower Arrangement Societies. Because of the duplication, your article has been tagged for speedy deletion. Please note that this is not a comment on you personally and we hope you will continue helping to improve Wikipedia. If the topic of the article you created is one that interests you, then perhaps you would like to help out at National Association of Flower Arrangement Societies - you might like to discuss new information at the article's talk page.

If you think that the article you created should remain separate, contest the deletion by clicking on the button labelled "Click here to contest this speedy deletion," which appears inside of the speedy deletion ({{db-...}}) tag (if no such tag exists, the page is no longer a speedy delete candidate). Doing so will take you to the talk page where you will find a pre-formatted place for you to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. You can also visit the the page's talk page directly to give your reasons, but be aware that once tagged for speedy deletion, if the page meets the criterion, it may be deleted without delay. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag yourself, but don't hesitate to add information to the page that would render it more in conformance with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. If the page is deleted, you can contact one of these administrators to request that the administrator userfy the page or email a copy to you. Additionally if you would like to have someone review articles you create before they go live so they are not nominated for deletion shortly after you post them, allow me to suggest the article creation process and using our search feature to find related information we already have in the encyclopedia. Try not to be discouraged. Wikipedia looks forward to your future contributions. Nat Gertler (talk) 01:48, 23 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

This page was last edited by NatGertler (contribs | logs) 7 hours ago

   Please consider placing the template:
   ==Your contributed article, National Association of Flower Aranging Societies==

Hello, I notice that you recently created a new page, National Association of Flower Aranging Societies. First, thank you for your contribution; Wikipedia relies solely on the efforts of volunteers such as you. Unfortunately, the page you created covers a topic on which we already have a page - National Association of Flower Arrangement Societies. Because of the duplication, your article has been tagged for speedy deletion. Please note that this is not a comment on you personally and we hope you will continue helping to improve Wikipedia. If the topic of the article you created is one that interests you, then perhaps you would like to help out at National Association of Flower Arrangement Societies - you might like to discuss new information at the article's talk page.

If you think that the article you created should remain separate, contest the deletion by clicking on the button labelled "Click here to contest this speedy deletion," which appears inside of the speedy deletion ({{db-...}}) tag (if no such tag exists, the page is no longer a speedy delete candidate). Doing so will take you to the talk page where you will find a pre-formatted place for you to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. You can also visit the the page's talk page directly to give your reasons, but be aware that once tagged for speedy deletion, if the page meets the criterion, it may be deleted without delay. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag yourself, but don't hesitate to add information to the page that would render it more in conformance with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. If the page is deleted, you can contact one of these administrators to request that the administrator userfy the page or email a copy to you. Additionally if you would like to have someone review articles you create before they go live so they are not nominated for deletion shortly after you post them, allow me to suggest the article creation process and using our search feature to find related information we already have in the encyclopedia. Try not to be discouraged. Wikipedia looks forward to your future contributions. Robert of Ramsor (talk) 09:33, 23 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

   on the talk page of the author. -- Robert of Ramsor (talk) 09:33, 23 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

No problem, we all make mistakes, and this was one easily cleared away. You may wish to be particularly careful when composing your titles; even if "Arranging" had been correct, "Aranging" with just one R certainly wouldn't have been, and correcting an error in the title, while not difficult, does add a bit more complication than correcting a misspelling anywhere else in the article. Perhaps that same spelling error afflicted your searches? --Nat Gertler (talk) 13:11, 23 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

You are cordially invited to participate in WikiProject Arminianism The goal of WikiProject Arminianism is to improve the quality and quantity of information about Arminianism available on Wikipedia. WP:WikiProject Arminianism as a group does not prefer any particular tradition or denominination of Calvinism, but prefers that all Arminian traditions are fairly and accurately represented.

Welcome to WikiProject Arminianism! Are you willing to help clean up the project page, invite new editors, and help expand the project? We are in the early stages of the project, but need to work hard to catch up to our Calvinist brothers. Also, a project on Methodism is not really needed since there is already a work group on the topic. I wouldn't be against one, however I think we should focus on the Arminian project first then see what else is needed. Again, thanks for your contribution!Theseus1776 (talk) 14:30, 26 September 2011 (UTC)[reply]