Sociology Start‑class

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The part about funerals for firefighters seems pretty non-sequitur. There are lots of specific traditions for deceased people of various professions; to list a single one seems odd. Either delete, or make a new section that includes military funerals, police, youth, et cetera. Tuckerma 19:47, 20 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The heading "traditional funerals" should be renamed to something like "Christian funerals." It is not relevant to Jewish funerals (and some of the stuff on Jewish mourning practices is somewhat inaccurate).

This article is very North-American based, for example 'wakes' are only briefly referred to in the context of 'Irish descendants' whereas wakes are a feature of Irish funerals in general so perhaps the section on Irish-descendants needs to be linked to a larger section on Irish funerals? --whoever wrote that an Irish wake is a party for 3 day needs their head examined. delete delete delete for 3 days.

The word "decedent" is misspelled throughout the article. It is spelled "decedant" in many places here. Radishes 23:37, 3 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for that. This has been fixed. Graham 07:18, 4 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Should it not be "the deceased" rather than "the decedent" anyways? Tuckerma 19:47, 20 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The session Funeral garlands style's is completely inadequate for Wikipedia. It should be written in a more neutral, objective style.

I have never heard of a newspaper refusing to accept a death notice that asks for no flowers. Is this common, as suggested in the article? I expect that the sentence should be deleted (or at the very least, change "most newspapers" to "some newspapers"), but I don't have any experience in this area, so I'd like to seek some clarification before editing. - Cafemusique 19:33 20 May 2003 (UTC)

Jessica Mitford's The American Way of Death quotes a newspaperman who said, "We couldn't publish a notice like that. Why, the florists would be right on our necks!" In some states, I understand that the issue has been dealt with by legislation. Locally, obituaries asking specifically that flowers be omitted are still never seen, so I gather that the practice is not entirely obsolete. -- IHCOYC 13:40 21 May 2003 (UTC)

They're very common here in Canada, actually. Looking at the last 20 obits in the Herald, 12 say "no flowers, donations instead to..." and 4 say "in lieu of flowers, please make contributions to...". The other four say "no funeral service will be held". --Charlene 12:05, 11 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

-In South Wales (and i assume most of the UK?) there is no say-so from the newspapers about what is included in the obituary notice, what is written is down to the family of the deceased, guided by the experience of the funeral director. However, our local newspaper will not allow thanks to be given in the obituary, but when i asked them why, they didn't know.(!)Kim3000 15:31, 30 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Moved;

The deceased person is usually either cremated or deposited in a tomb, often a hole in the earth, called a grave. Graves are usually grouped together in a plot of land called a "cemetery" or a "graveyard" and are often arranged by a funeral home or undertaker.

As I'm not sure this actually fits with 'funeral' so much as 'what happens to a dead body'. perhaps a subtle distinction, but funeral should be more about the ceremony & customs I feel- the above text perhpsa could be worked in further down the page? quercus robur 11:26 23 May 2003 (UTC)

I expanded this a bit and gave it its own section. It probably fits here better than I can imagine it fitting into anywhere else; it could, of course, be split up between tomb, cremation, and so forth, but there probably should be a list of all of them. "What happens to a dead body" seems an odd subject heading, and besides, we already have that article at decomposition. -- IHCOYC 15:32 23 May 2003 (UTC)

As a general observation, the selection of regions covered is very piecemeal. More specifically, the North American section needs a reference to Mexico, a glaring omission. I believe the ceremonies are different there from the US, but I don't know to what extent. I can't make sense of the section on an Irish Wake; if I could, I'm pretty sure it would belong under Visitation, not Luncheon. There's also some inconsistent usage of "memorial service". Last thing, under Japan, the sentence on "Oriental" cultures (aside from its pejorative connotations) seems to present a very specific detail that is presumably (but not overtly) related to the previous paragraph without any further detail. Free 00:27, 2005 August 12 (UTC).

I don't know where someone ripped-off this information, but it's definitely not in-line with Wiki's neutral point-of-view policy. Furthermore, the punctuation and capitalization conventions are outdated. I'm going to edit this, although I have nothing to contribute to the article itself. --JH. Jan 8, 2005

there needs to be something on continental services, I've heard that the Dutch don't do embalmings and I imagine there is probably a good deal of variation in europe. -K 26/2/05

Every insight counts. Please allow individual to brief through and we will determine if it's relevant.  :)

Europe is also seeing an increase in secular, non religious funeral ceremonies, but there is virtually no mention of that here. A funeral needn't be religious at all. (User:arthurchappell

It talkts about Japanese whcvvcbvnbg nngjymjhjjjite clothes, and then about Chinese white enveloppe presents?

I know quite a few people back in my village don't make the difference between chinese, japanese and thai, but this is an Encyclopedia!

Problem is, I can't correct the thing myself because I don't know whether it was refering to a Japanese habit, or a general asian thing. (Cefalópodo 12:02, 20 September 2005 (UTC))[reply]

regarding these concerns, i've done some editing on this section. "oriental" was changed to the more specific "east" and "southeast asian", since "oriental" can also refer to other parts of asia. more work is needed however.

Just wanted to let you know someone quite knowledgable in this field added that article... and that it can be merged and/or expanded. - RoyBoy ⁸⁰⁰ 05:23, 30 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Viewing, Visitation, and Wake are not the same thing. A viewing is just that - viewing the body. It can take place in the hospital, home, funeral parlor, religious edifice, public building, and/or graveside. A visitation need not involve the body at all. It involves visiting the bereaved – usually within a week or so of the death. Visitation and viewing are often merged. A wake is a celebration of the deceased's life and generally involves a party. Rklawton 15:34, 7 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I removed the following:

• Information about making an anatomical gift at Georgetown University School of Medicine

because the link to AMS lists many medical schools which accept anatomical gifts, whereas Georgetown is only one

• Article about post-mortem cannibalism

is just plain weird. I could be wrong about that one; maybe it really is relevant to funeral, but it doesn't look it to me.

• Modern alternatives to the traditional funerals from the Chicagoland Vibary Network

is spam. Twice, in fact, two links in one sentence

• Easybyte - free easy piano arrangements of music suitable for funerals (Thaxted, Purcell, Chopin)

is nice, but the vast majority of the music is not funeral music. Just zis  Guy, you know? ^[T]/_[C] AfD? 11:23, 31 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

There never was any such thing as the The Guild of Funerary Violinists

• http://www.thestrad.com/ticker.asp

• http://www.guardian.co.uk/usa/story/0,,1887655,00.html

• http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=408588&in_page_id=1770

• http://www.rohan-k.co.uk/guildbooks.html

Ogg 10:44, 13 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I originally deleted this link because it appeared to be an article mainly talking about the beliefs (rather than the funeral rites) of a minor Christian tradition. To include links to all similarly popular customs would overwhelm the article, and actual the information about funeral rites is minimal and buried far down the page. Hence my reasoning of it being unencyclopedic in this context. I do not think the link should be on the article, but since another editor disagrees I thought I should bring this to the talk page to find out what other editors think. --Siobhan Hansa 03:41, 26 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for your fine comment. I strongly agree with the deletion of external links to commercial, forum or blog sites (as it is already defined at WP:EL). However, informative links (as the mentioned one) describe specific funeral rites or methods which are often associated to specific religious-spiritual contexts ("beliefs", traditions) of each specific culture (and these traditions exist from ancient times to current-days). In this sense, I think that if links exist, and are added, to specific funeral rites (or to beliefs which require and describe specific funeral methods) it should be welcome as it gives opportunity for firsthand acquaintance with them (see the example of Spirituality article with links according to each specific tradition). For me it is a study field of special interest, but I did not find till now many sites online dwelling into this subject. However, whatever the decision of editors, keep or remove, it will be accepted and the current link (introduced by myself) kept or removed accordingly. Thank you for your attention. --Viriathus 20:48, 26 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I removed a paragraph stating that it's very rude to have your phone turned on during a funeral - which seems rather obvious for an encyclopedia article - what next? an exhortation not to sing showtunes as the coffin is lowered?!. And for someone to request a citation! - Who is going to confirm it? Better to delete than be daft with citation requests. Stevingtonian 11:14, 18 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Perhaps someone has a book by Miss Manners available where she addresses funeral etiquette. If it is inserted back in, she would likely be considered a reliable source ... but I want to see what, if anything, she has to say first — including showtunes. [[Briguy52748 (talk) 19:01, 15 April 2008 (UTC)]][reply]

This text was added to the article, presumably referring to Jewish funeral customs:

Consult Roth, Cecil. Encyclopedia Judaica. Keter House, 1972. See entries on Funerals & Cemeteries & Death Customs.

Graham87 02:06, 1 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Have there been any night funerals in some cases? I know most funerals are in the daytime, but I'm just curious as to if they do have night funerals.

I was reading the section and noticed that it is written as "Wefind" and "Weread." I just want to check to see if there's any reason for this before I change it. --Romulus 03:20, 8 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

No, there's no particular reason for that. Use of "we" is usually unencyclopedic unless it is part of a quote. Graham87 11:07, 8 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I'm going to change it in the 'Ancient funeral rites intro', then --Romulus 01:03, 15 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Instead of listing funerals from a number of places and then saying "Main article..." can we place a small description of each funeral there? Saves having to jump from page to page to compare minor and major differences. Thanks Naysie (my tildes key is broken)

I'm very concerned about this entry. Full disclosure: I'm the executive director of a nonprofit consumer advocacy charity, founded in 1963, dedicated to protecting people from funeral fraud, and from overspending in funerals. The organization I work for, Funeral Consumers Alliance [www.funerals.org] is a federation of nonprofit societies that lobbied for the passage of the Federal Trade Commission's "Funeral Rule," the only national regulations giving the bereaved the right to accurate price information, and the right to choose only what they want and can afford [1].

The heading, "Traditional Funerals," is very misleading. As others have pointed out, it's U.S.-centric. It would not even be accurate to relabel it "Christian Funerals," since the practice of embalming and making-up the body for full public display has no roots in Christianity. It is, in fact, a creation of the late 19th-century commercial American mortuary industry. It also fails to acknowledge the fact that what the U.S. calls a "traditional" funeral is, in fact, a very recent commercially created "tradition" (Mitford, 1963. The American Way of Death. Simon & Schuster, New York. PP. 222 - 240).

Much of this entry appears to have been written from the point of view of those who sell funerals. The article does not have nearly enough from the consumers of funerals, or from the watchdog groups that try to protect the public from undue sales pressure. Much of what this article cites as fact is hotly contested by consumer advocates. There is much more to this story that needs to be told.

Joshuaslocum 02:23, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

Given your conflict of interest, the best place to begin addressing these problems would be right here on the talk page. You can post here specific suggestions and links to neutral sources. Neutral editors can then review them and, if appropriate, add them to the article. Don't hesitate to ask for help. Cheers - Rklawton 04:08, 2 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

White tie is prefered in a funeral, at least in parts of Europe, if the person was very close to the deceased. Why doesn't the article mention anything about that? --The monkeyhate 15:35, 27 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

As the number of non-religious people has grown to a massive number recently, does anyone know if there are funeral services conducted in a secular manner without any religion, how they work etc? (Simon.uk.21 00:00, 9 September 2007 (UTC))[reply]

I'd be fine with a mention of that in the article, but Wikipedia does not allow direct copy-and-pastes from websites - they are usually copyright violations, and in the case of the BBC they definitely are. While doing a quick search I found the Wikipedia article Humanist officiant which seems to be relevant. Graham87 07:52, 9 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

To Simon.uk.21's question, I recently attended a friend's funeral, which was a humanist service. No mention of God, although the funeral did take part in a C of E church because it was the only local venue large enough to accommodate the vast quantity of mourners. It was without a doubt the most beautiful funeral I had ever attended, more info from the British Humanist Association here. I will add something to the Wikipedia page regarding this. Tris2000 (talk) 10:19, 2 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I've fixed up the lede by adding correct historical information and reliable cites. Bearian (talk) 17:03, 4 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

"Of course, most family members of a deceased person would regard any wishes the deceased had made known as carrying considerable moral authority." Why is there general assumptions in this article?

Pinothyj (talk) 03:54, 17 October 2008 (UTC)…[reply]

中国人的葬礼比较重视“哭”这个环节，家属越是嚎啕大哭，越是形销骨立，越被视为对死者悲痛的深切，越是合格的孝道。而在西方葬礼前后，你很少看到家属在众人面前痛哭失声，相反故作坚强往往是合乎礼节的做法。西方人甚至往往会在葬礼的追思仪式上，善意地讲一些死者生前的糗事，以逗笑全场为目的。但他们这样做的目的绝对不是要不尊重死者，而是他们觉得轻松的幽默是战胜伤痛的的最好办法，而且能让亲友更好的记住死者当年的风趣和可爱。 西方葬礼上用的最多的是百合花，它往往象征着“纯洁”。因此英语中它常和“死亡”联系起来。同样也可以使用白玫瑰或者菊花。另外需要格外注意的是，菊花在任何欧洲国家都只用于万圣节和葬礼，一般不宜送人。白色的百合花在英国象征死亡，也不宜送人。 受到邀请出席葬礼的人也就应该尽可能穿黑色的衣服，男子要系黑色无花图案的领带。如果没有黑色衣服，就应该穿颜色暗淡、深沉的衣服，切忌鲜艳的服装。佩戴黑色的宽边帽，或在发髻上盖上黑纱，或戴上黑色的墨镜，都是比较得体的做法。而中国传统葬礼上都是披麻戴孝，用白色来表示哀悼。 葬礼的前一天是守丧，人们都要去殡仪馆瞻仰死者遗容，你不一定要亲眼去凑近棺木看死者，你可以去慰问死者家属，这在英语中叫表示哀悼。中国人喜欢说：节哀顺便，而在英语中则常说；I am sorry to hear about your loss.这样的意思就是表示你感受到了别人丧亲的痛苦。如果和死者生前素不相识，那表达悼念的时候一定要适可而止，切忌对死因过着家中私事刨根问底，这样的“关切”多半会招来西方人的反感。 葬礼前探望丧家时，也可以适当准备一些小礼物。但西方人是绝对不会在这个时候送钱的。送鲜花当然很好，送照片、卡片或纪念品也不错，如果是街坊邻居，你可以送自己亲手做的饼干或比萨。 西方国家葬礼上的花圈不用纸扎的假花，上面通常会有一些卡片、照片或题词等。 教堂的葬礼仪式上，神父在开头通常会说：We are gathered here to say farewell to XXX and to commit him into the hands of God.随后，一般还会有sing the hymn(唱圣歌)或read the Bible等程序。 教堂葬礼只是整个葬礼部分的前半部分，后者部分是在墓地举行，只有死者的家属，近亲和亲密的朋友参加，一般好友在参加完教堂葬礼后即可离去，不必去墓地。葬礼多以土葬为主，但也可以选择火葬。亲朋目送灵柩在事先指定好的墓穴中安葬。人们围绕在墓穴周围，为死者祷告，愿它安息、灵魂升入天堂。应邀参加亲友家的葬礼，唯一可送的礼物就是鲜花，也可送用鲜花做成的花圈。神父这时候在坟墓边需要完成第三个仪式：安葬仪式。神父会抓三把土撒在棺材上，然后朗读《圣经》中的段落，为逝者祷告，为生者祈福。在全部仪式结束后，神父会说：Give him,O Lord,your peace and let you eternal light shine upon him,Amen. 丧家在丧期往往还需要做一件事情，那就是给表示过吊慰或出席葬礼的亲友写感谢信，但现在多以送卡居多。卡片上的文字务必简短，否则与当事人应有的悲伤不相符。口吻应该庄重肃穆，既要感谢亲友，追念亡者，同时要适当变现自己的坚强。