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The result of the discussion was keep. -- Tavix ^(talk) 17:22, 14 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Csaszar → Császár  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

(eubot) Straight drop of the accents, but makes it a bit nonsense... usually I would keep when it is a simple legit {{R from title without diacritics}}, but to an English-speaking audience I am wondering whether it is too easy to confuse with cognates such as Czar, Caesar and the like. The article itself has no enyclopaedic content and should be deleted. Si Trew (talk) 23:52, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep per WP:DIACRITICS and maybe hatnote if it can be seen as confusing (i.e. {{distinguish|text=[[Czar]] and [[Caesar]]}} to get
  Not to be confused with Czar and Caesar.
  . ---- Patar knight - ^chat/_{contributions} 00:33, 7 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep per WP:DIACRITICS. I doubt a hatnote is necessary here, but if there's a real risk of confusion, that should be the best option. Sideways713 (talk) 15:17, 7 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep as a standard diacritic-less variant. I don't really see how someone wishing to get to Czar or Caesar would ever arrive at this title, but a hatnote would be harmless. – Uanfala (talk) 11:28, 14 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was delete as unopposed. -- Tavix ^(talk) 15:01, 17 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Daruessafaka → Darüşşafaka  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

(eubot) Not Germanic but Turkish. Target is a DAB page. Si Trew (talk) 23:49, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was keep. -- Tavix ^(talk) 14:52, 17 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Tonacaçiguatl → Tonacacihuatl  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 
• Tonacaciguatl → Tonacacihuatl  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

(eubot created the second from the first) neither are now at target, nor anything similar ending in "-guatl". Perhaps it was when the R was created, but now both are just WP:RFD#D2 confusing, not at target. Si Trew (talk) 23:39, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep both as getting use [1], [2]. ---- Patar knight - ^chat/_{contributions} 14:20, 13 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep at least Tonacaciguatl as it gets a fair number of hits per Patar knight's findings. – Uanfala (talk) 11:49, 16 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was delete as unopposed. -- Tavix ^(talk) 14:59, 17 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Toev Prefecture → Töv Province  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

(eubot) Not Germanic but Mongolian. Si Trew (talk) 23:38, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was keep as a form that is used in sources (non-admin closure) – Uanfala (talk) 11:25, 14 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Kinga Goencz → Kinga Göncz  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

(eubot) Not Germanic but (old) Hungarian. "Göncz" is an old spelling that would not exist in modern Hungarian but is preserved in old family names. We can't proceed to mangle it this way. Si Trew (talk) 23:36, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep, seems to get use in sources [3], [4], [5], [6], [7] and if it's "preserved in old family names" as you say, that's another reason to keep it as an alternate spelling. ---- Patar knight - ^chat/_{contributions} 13:58, 13 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was keep. (non-admin closure) – Uanfala (talk) 11:24, 14 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Livlaendische Aa → Gauja  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

(eubot) Not Germanic but Latvian Si Trew (talk) 23:34, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep since it is in fact German, not Latvian. It's not getting any hits to speak of, but it's harmless and cheap and we've normally kept German ä->ae ones unless there's another reason to delete. Sideways713 (talk) 15:04, 7 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was keep. -- Tavix ^(talk) 17:22, 14 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Croisees → Glossary of ballet  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

(eubot) Not at target. Just dropping the French accents would usually not bother me, but the target is a glossary and is very particular with the terms and gives etymologies and pronunciation guides etc, so this is just wrong, it defeats the purpose of telling people what the terms are used in ballet, if any old term can be redirected to it. Were I to redirect "Balles entournees" or "mal aux pieds" to it, I don't think I would get far saying that it is just my own word for these things, we shouldn't make things up like this. WP:RFD#D2 confusing, not at target. Croisées from which this was formed is not at the target either, but that's a bit more marginal, because it is more obvious that it is not an English word, whereas this one could be English. We all know from our schoolboy french that it's the past tense feminine plural form of the adjective to agree with the noun (because legs are feminine), but not in English it ain't. The glossary explains all so there is no need to add inaccurate terms to it. Si Trew (talk) 23:30, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep as {{R from plural}}. I fixed up the anchors for Croisée in the meantime. AngusWOOF (bark • sniff) 10:02, 7 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep per AngusWOOF. ---- Patar knight - ^chat/_{contributions} 14:21, 13 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was keep. Leaving rcat tagging of the redirect to editor discretion. (non-admin closure) – Uanfala (talk) 11:23, 14 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• 91/2 Weeks → 9½ Weeks  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

(eubot). I don't think this film is about 45.5 Weeks, but I suppose it is harmless. Si Trew (talk) 23:23, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep attracts 1-5 searches a day, not as much as 9 and a half weeks but still used. AngusWOOF (bark • sniff) 10:09, 7 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep per AngusWOOF. Valid {{R from incorrect name}}. ---- Patar knight - ^chat/_{contributions} 14:22, 13 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was delete. -- Tavix ^(talk) 14:51, 17 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• (Mamacita) ?Donde Esta Santa Claus? (Where Is Santa Claus?) → ¿Dónde Está Santa Claus?  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

(eubot) I seem to recall listing similar Eubot variations on this one, but can't remember the outcome. Si Trew (talk) 23:17, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Wikipedia:Redirects_for_discussion/Log/2016_December_2#Mamacita.2C_.C2.BFd.C3.B3nde_est.C3.A1_Santa_Claus.3F_.28Mommy.2C_Where.27s_Santa_Claus.3F.29 and a few others on that day. Two were deleted but Mamacita ?Donde Esta Santa Claus? was kept. Si Trew (talk) 23:18, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete per previous discussions where similar phrased titles were deleted. ---- Patar knight - ^chat/_{contributions} 14:23, 13 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was delete. -- Tavix ^(talk) 14:50, 17 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Kuebekhaza → Kübekháza  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

(eubot) Not Germanic but Hungarian. Si Trew (talk) 23:15, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete per nom and the fact that this doesn't get any sensible ghits. – Uanfala (talk) 12:21, 16 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was delete. -- Tavix ^(talk) 14:50, 17 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Nigueella → Nigüella  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

(eubot) not Germanic but Spanish. WP:RFD#D5 nonsense. Si Trew (talk) 23:14, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete as nonsense without any hits on google scholar or google books. – Uanfala (talk) 12:19, 16 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was keep. -- Tavix ^(talk) 14:52, 17 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Buekk Mountains → Bükk  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

(eubot) Not Germanic but Hungarian. Si Trew (talk) 23:13, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep. Even if incorrect, it's a used transliteration. [8] ---- Patar knight - ^chat/_{contributions} 14:04, 13 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep per Patar knight. – Uanfala (talk) 12:18, 16 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was keep. as evidence of use has been found. -- Tavix ^(talk) 14:51, 17 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Prozzaek → Prozzäk  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

(eubot). Canadian pop group, WP:FIRSTSENTENCE says " The name "Prozzäk" was inspired by the drug Prozac". But the name "Prozzaek" wasn't. The article doesn't say or imply that this is a metal umlaut, it doesn't seem tobe a heavy metal band, but it's certainly not a Germanic umlaut. Si Trew (talk) 23:10, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep as valid search term per use in this article. ---- Patar knight - ^chat/_{contributions} 14:07, 13 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was keep as the term is used in the target (non-admin closure) – Uanfala (talk) 11:30, 14 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Oxalá → Obatala  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 
• Oxala → Obatala  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

(second is eubot created from the first). WP:RFD#D2 confusing, not at target. Si Trew (talk) 23:06, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep. It's in the Obatala#Candombl.C3.A9_and_Santer.C3.ADa. Maybe refine there if it's unique to that region. ---- Patar knight - ^chat/_{contributions} 00:37, 7 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was delete as unopposed. -- Tavix ^(talk) 14:58, 17 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Tueshig, Selenge → Tüshig, Selenge  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

(eubot) Not Germanic but Mongolian. Si Trew (talk) 23:05, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was Speedy keep. Bad faith joke, this is not funny, clearly a useful redirect and it is not even April Fools' Day (non-admin closure) - CHAMPION ^{(talk) (contributions) (logs)} 23:33, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Barack obama → Barack Obama  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

Exactly no-one cares that they have been redirected from barack obama to Barack Obama, even if of those zero people, the proportion who want it to be the very first thing they see in the article is 100%. Delete and salt. Sienti (씨유엔티) 13:41, 6 April 2017 (UTC) Sienti (씨유엔티) 13:41, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I've de-tagged the redirect for the moment, if consensus to delete builds up here we'll technically have to put it back I guess. Sienti (씨유엔티) 13:51, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep. Minor capitalization differences are generally kept, and this one gets 164 hits a day. ---- Patar knight - ^chat/_{contributions} 14:23, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

  Where are those hits coming from, do you think? Sienti (씨유엔티) 14:27, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

  does it really matter where they are coming from? -- Aunva6^{talk - contribs} 19:58, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

  For example if they were all typed into the search box? Siuenti (씨유엔티) 19:59, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep - A plausible error someone could make if he/she is typing the URL directly into the address bar WhisperToMe (talk) 17:36, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]
• keep useful redirect -- Aunva6^{talk - contribs} 19:58, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment. If these are standardly kept, I guess that's fine, but why do we do that exactly? The software sends you to the right place anyway, if you type it in the search box, and you really shouldn't be linking to it. --Trovatore (talk) 20:06, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

  They serve people who type "barack obama" into the url, and maybe some other searches/ links but I'm not sure. Siuenti (씨유엔티) 20:09, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

  To clarify, some people including my self would get from en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donald_Trump to Barack Obama by deleting the "Donald Trump" part and replacing it with /barack obama

  These people benefit because if there is no redirect they would end up on a page like this one Red_adair&redirect=no which is useless to them. Siuenti (씨유엔티) 20:16, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

If you typed "barack obama" into the URL it would be an ill-formed URL, because URLs can't contain spaces. So somewhere along the line your typing of "barack obama" has been reformatted, anyway. The only question is where that happens. If it's the Google search bar, I think that replaces the space with %20% before sending, but doesn't change the caps. Wikipedia then changes the space to underscore for finding the article, so either you typed "barack_obama" or something along the chain did all that behind your back, anyway, and behind your back the WP search also converts lettercase if there isn't an exact title match. It didn't used to, but it has done now for a couple of years, so most {{R from other capitalization}}s are rather redundant nowadays. The advice at WP:REDIRECT#Purposes of redirects includes:

• Likely alternative capitalizations (for example, Natural Selection redirects to Natural selection). This is not necessary for user searches made via Wikipedia's search engine, but may aid linking from other articles and external sites, as well as direct URL entry.

I seem to remember arguing after the case-sensitivity changes to the WP search engine that that advice was now out-of-date, but nothing happened about it. I think it is also positively encouraged somewhere deep in the bowels of MoS, which I gave up looking at years ago, since it is a rabbit hole I don't want to go down. Si Trew (talk) 21:32, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

So you would say there would be little or no harm from deletion? Siuenti (씨유엔티) 21:47, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I'd say there would be absolutely no harm from deletion. But consensus on these usually is to keep as harmless. Si Trew (talk) 22:14, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Here's my objection to having (Redirected from Barack obama) right at the top of the article:

  No-one could conceivably be interested in that information

  But Wikipedia wouldn't put totally useless info at the top of the article if it knew what it was doing

  If I assume Wikipedia does know what it's doing, I will waste my time reading it

  The optional strategy of ignoring it completely is only available to people who realize that Wikipedia doesn't know what it is doing Siuenti (씨유엔티) 22:00, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Here's my other objection:

  Just because I typed it that was doesn't mean it's my aesthetic preference.

  In fact, my preference is the correctly capitalized version .

  and in even more fact, I think Barack obama looks ugly and totally out of place in a quality encyclopedia which might be expected to have a manual of style of some kind. Siuenti (씨유엔티) 22:12, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I see your point. I think it is only the desktop browser that does that, the mobile browser omits that "redirected from" line so you can be even more confused about why you ended up somewhere (This is why Goed does not exist). Most people familiar with Wikipedia skim that annoying bit at the top, but I agree with you, why say as kinda even before the lede that "The most important thing we know about Barack Obama is that some people call him barack obama"? There's probably a good case for relegating that R information to the bottom of the article, like the mobile version does, but that's outside the scope of what to do with this particular redirect, which is of course Delete on my part, for the reasons I have given at too much length. Si Trew (talk) 22:14, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Siuenti:, I deleted yours in a series of edit conflicts, I've added it back in from the previous version, but please check I have done it OK and not mangled your words. I don't really look at the manual of style much, because it changes like twenty times a day so WP:COMMONSENSE is better except on very technical things like how to format fractions, anything else in there is just a battle of opinions from people who rarely actually edit articles or think about getting readers to where they want to go, so it's not worth wasting time on. Redirects are the index of this encyclopaedia, even though we have categories, lists, WikiProjects, and 101 other ways of finding stuff, redirects are the most visible part of the index. They are the index, to a great extent. It does us well to care about how that looks. Si Trew (talk) 22:17, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I don't think the MOS position on whether "Barack obama" is good style changes more than every few years. Siuenti (씨유엔티) 22:40, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Basically it come down to whether you thing WP:ARTICLETITLE applies to redirects (that changed three times yesterday the fifth, and once today the sixth, so not "every few years"). I say it does, and I infer that you think it does, but the consensus is that it doesn't. There are obvious exceptions for things like {{R from misspelling}} and {{R from incorrect name}}, i.e. anything that is reliably sourced as "wrong", but just because something "gets hits" doesn't mean much to me, because if it didn't exist, it wouldn't get hits, so we can't make a comparison with the theoretical case of something not existing and people getting to the exact same target with the exact same term, by search, URL, or whatever, if it didn't exist (i.e. we have no control group). When WP:REDIRECT says that it "may aid linking from other articles", that is bollox advice in my opinion: the solution to that is to fix the articles, not make an R from incorrect spelling. Essentially, anything in {{R from incorrect capitalisation}} and suchlike should have no internal links, and those should just be sorting categories. It stems really from the idea that WP:Accidental linking is a good thing; that may have been the case back in the days of CamelCase and an even worse search engine, but is not true now. Si Trew (talk) 22:48, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was delete. -- Tavix ^(talk) 17:20, 14 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Wikipedia:/sandbox → Wikipedia:Sandbox  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

Implausible typo (both colon and slash). – Train2104 (t • c) 13:36, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete - I don't think that this is particularly helpful. CoffeeWithMarkets (talk) 09:21, 7 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was delete. -- Tavix ^(talk) 17:20, 14 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• UKexit → Brexit  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

Not at target, WP:MADEUP. WP:RFD#D2 confusing, not at target. Variants such as ukexit seem all to be red. Si Trew (talk) 12:05, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete not used term. AngusWOOF (bark • sniff) 16:44, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete Unused term, essentially zero traffic via this redirect. Mélencron (talk) 15:46, 7 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was keep. -- Tavix ^(talk) 17:19, 14 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Oroszlamos → Banatsko Aranđelovo  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

(eubot) This was known in Hungarian as "Oroszlámos", as the article says, but was never known as "Oroszlamos". (Orosz = country, state, state government as a prefix). This makes no sense in Hungarian but this is the English WP so I suppose it is OK, but since the title is foreign-language and so is the redirect it was created from, then to aribtrarily anglicise it when it is not known in English as "Oroszlamos" is a bit iffy. Will mark as {{R from other language|hu}} without prejudice. Si Trew (talk) 09:25, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep per WP:DIACRITICS. No user of English Wikipedia should be expected to be familiar with Hungarian diacritics. ---- Patar knight - ^chat/_{contributions} 14:10, 13 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was delete. -- Tavix ^(talk) 17:18, 14 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Qamduen → Qamdün  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

(eubot) Not Germanic but Tibetan. Non-notable village that is just a geostub, article should probably be deleted as having no encylopaedic content. Si Trew (talk) 09:08, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was keep. -- Tavix ^(talk) 17:16, 14 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Cauge → Caugé  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

(eubot) Not sure. This is just an {{R from title without diacritics}}, correctly for a change (as Eubot did not carry over any other Rcats on the R it was making an R from, leading to nonsense), but I wonder if "Gauge" or "Cage" are more likely attempts than trying to find a small village in France. It might be better off to delete it and let the search engine do it. Si Trew (talk) 09:01, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep, don't inconvenience people who can spell for the benefit of people who can't. Sienti (씨유엔티) 13:22, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

It's not a question of whether people can spell or whether they can find "é" on their keyboard, because this is not the correct spelling in the first place. People who can spell (or copy-paste) will presumably type "Caugé", but considering that this village really isn't notable by WP standards it seems to me more likely that people miss the keys or have read something wrongly (if they are not native English speakers" and see something that looks like "Cauge" but actually is "Gauge". I have absolutely no evidence of this, of course.

Really it's a question of WP:UNDUE. Going through all of these Eubot redirects to places, I've been forming the my opinion that having all these geostubs that tell you nothing about the place is not very helpful anyway, yet we tend to get half a dozen redirects to a place with various misspelling, to somewhere that is not notable in the first place; the presence of those redirects could make it seem notable beause it's not a WP:ORPHAN and so on. All the information in the target is scraped from geographical databases by bots, except for the addition of population which was done by a human editor: no actual enclopaeidic content has been added. We have of course hundreds of thousands of these useless geostubs but I don't think that Wikipedia is supposed to be some atlas, but when we have an article about the place it should say something about the place beyond its vital statistics, WP:NOTDIRECTORY. Si Trew (talk) 20:37, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Links to this article are almost exclusively through the navbox from other places that are also not notable and follow the same pattern. This mass import happened for French communes, happened for Hungarian villages, and no doubt for small places in other countries too but those and British ones are those that I know about. They're not encylopaedic at all. I presume the intent was that once the scaffolding was in place, people would feel it easier to add content, but in fact no content has been added. Si Trew (talk) 21:03, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep per WP:DIACRITICS. If there's risk of confusion, feel free to add a hatnote. ---- Patar knight - ^chat/_{contributions} 14:12, 13 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was delete. -- Tavix ^(talk) 17:13, 14 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Toguei, Boyaca → Togüí, Boyacá  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

(eubot) not germanic but (Colombian) Spanish. WP:RFD#D5 nonsense. Si Trew (talk) 08:53, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was keep. -- Tavix ^(talk) 17:13, 14 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Masat Hoeyuek → Maşat Höyük  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

(eubot) Not Germanic but Turkish. Si Trew (talk) 08:48, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep. Shockingly, gets used as a transliteration by this academic work from a Germanic language. [9]. ---- Patar knight - ^chat/_{contributions} 14:13, 13 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep per Patar knight's findings. – Uanfala (talk) 11:31, 14 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was keep as evidence of use has been provided. -- Tavix ^(talk) 17:12, 14 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Oulujaervi → Oulujärvi  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

(eubot) not germanic, but Finnish. Lede gives Swedish (Germanic) name, as "Ule träsk", so I am not sure then to invent a germanic name when that is not the germanic name is very helpful. Si Trew (talk) 08:46, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep. It's a transliteration that gets use. [10] ---- Patar knight - ^chat/_{contributions} 14:26, 13 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was keep. -- Tavix ^(talk) 17:09, 14 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Mons Ruemker → Mons Rümker  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

(eubot) probably this is OK but is technically a mixed-language redirect because "Mons" is Latin, not English, so if something is named like this it is named on purpose (like plant names that User:Plantdrew can usually answer) and the whole point is to name it unambiguously, not to then screw it up by adding variations. This is a fairly simple one, but I think on the cusp, Eubot just renamed a mountain on the moon. Si Trew (talk) 08:43, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep per WP:DIACRITICS. "Mons" is standard use in space geography (see: Mons (planetary nomenclature)). ---- Patar knight - ^chat/_{contributions} 14:28, 13 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was delete. -- Tavix ^(talk) 17:12, 14 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Moero! Nekketsu Rhythm Damashii Osu! Tatakae! Oendan 2 → Moero! Nekketsu Rhythm Damashii Osu! Tatakae! Ouendan 2  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

(eubot) Delete. I cannot even see what the difference is between this redirect and its target, but patently it is not a {{R from title without diacritics}} nor a {{R from other language}} (Japanese) nor anything really except harmful clutter. Si Trew (talk) 08:33, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Ah, "Oenden 2" has somehow been kinda un-formed from "Ouenden 2", by way of "Moero! Nekketsu Rhythm Damashii Osu! Tatakae! Ōendan 2 ", I guess (that was created by User:Masem). I think this makes it bollox without the stress mark, doesn't it? Why not, otherwise, just knock off one of the i's in "Damashii"? The syllabary is important, I think, so one can't go buggering about with it like this: but I have forgotten most of what I learned in Japanese class. Si Trew (talk) 08:36, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I can see it being a {{R from misspelling}} but I am not sure anyone is going to type that whole lot out, exclamation marks and all, and the only mistake they make is turning a stress mark into an "oe". Of course, typing etc is not the only way people seach for things, but when they do search this way or copy-paste or whatever, this is just cluttering their search. Si Trew (talk) 09:05, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. Personally, I would not even bother to type all that out and would rather type just "Ouendan 2". Again, I doubt anyone would bother to type out the whole thing, minus a letter. Blorper234 (talk) 03:23, 9 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was keep by default as the nominator is OK with a keep. -- Tavix ^(talk) 17:07, 14 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Ponca City, OK mSA → Kay County, Oklahoma  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

(Eubot) This is probably OK but I can never remember the exact consensus on these "mSA" or "MSA" suffixes. Is this OK? Back-formed from the R at Ponca City, OK μSA. Probably a keep. Si Trew (talk) 08:31, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was delete as unopposed. -- Tavix ^(talk) 14:49, 17 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Gustav Adolfi Guemnaasium → Gustav Adolf Grammar School  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 
• Tallinna Gustav Adolfi Guemnaasium → Gustav Adolf Grammar School  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

(BOTH eubot) Not Germanic but Estonian. Plenty-o-redirects without dias to this one, without needing to make up this WP:RFD#D5 nonsense. the double "aa" in "Gumnaasium" is fine, that's in the Estonian (without diacritics anyway), but then taking the "u" to "ue" is not fine. Both as usual marked as {{R from title without diacritics}} when the target doesn't have any diacritics in it anyway; back-formed from Rs from titles with diacritics. Duh. Si Trew (talk) 08:21, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was keep. -- Tavix ^(talk) 14:55, 17 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Juerg M Stauffer → Jürg M. Stauffer  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

(Eubot) clutter, really. This has been back-formed from the redirect at Jürg M Stauffer, which is or should be a {{R from other punctuation}} (no dot after the middle initial). That's fine, but we don't have to pile on every conceivable variant, or we end up with the usual Windischgraetz of having eighteen redirects to one person, none of which actually helps a search, but can only hinder it. He has four of the more obvious redirects for "Jurg" etc, this one is just over-egging the pudding. Si Trew (talk) 08:05, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep per WP:DIACRITICS. ---- Patar knight - ^chat/_{contributions} 15:38, 13 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was keep. -- Tavix ^(talk) 14:55, 17 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Jaegerhorn af Spurila → Jägerhorn af Spurila  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

(Eubot). Something of a mixed-language redirect; Eubot has transliterated the "ä" to "ae" but not the "af" to "of". Not kinda a very strong argument that, because "af Spurila" is really the surname (like the "O" or "Mac" and so on in surnames), but if you want to get the surname right, get the forename right, too: if you want to translate one half of it, translate the other half, Don't mess with Mr. In-Between. Weak delete. Si Trew (talk) 07:59, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

The Twinkle API went down for a bit. I think this is fine, to add: Swedish not German proper, and although consensus is to keep Swedish ones, I think this enough to suggest a delete, weakly. Si Trew (talk) 08:02, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment: No, no, no, Si Trew. Jägerhorn is a surname, not a forename. There is no forename in this article title. And I really don't understand what relevance you think the Celtic "O" or "Mac" have in this case, as they have no obvious relationship or similarity to any part of this name. --Hegvald (talk) 01:15, 11 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep. Didn't we normally keep such redirects for Swedish names? As for the nom's rationale that the redirect mixes up its codes: the two parameters there are kind of orthogonal and its perfectly normal for the English rendering of a proper name to transliterate non-ASCII characters without at the same time translating the constituent words. – Uanfala (talk) 16:30, 16 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was keep. -- Tavix ^(talk) 14:47, 17 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Béla crater → Mons Hadley  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 
• Bela crater → Mons Hadley  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

(The second is a Eubot creation from the first). WP:RFD#D2 confusing, perhaps refine to section Mons Hadley#Nearby craters, but there is nothing really encyclopaeidic there, beyond its coordinates. The derivation there in the table is "Hungarian masculine name" (correctly) but "Bela" without the accent is not a common Hungarian masculine name. (Accents are significant in Hungarian.) That's no problem in itself, but combined I think this becomes a bit odd. It would be encyclopaedic if we said that it was named after e.g. Béla Bartok, but we don't, and WP:NOTDIRECTORY, Wikipedia is not just a place to list stuff without encyclopaedic content, not even coordinates of things on the moon. Search results I get all lead back to the Wikipedia article, so we need at least RS that NASA (presumably) did in fact name a crater on the moon "Béla". Si Trew (talk) 07:43, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep per WP:DIACRITICS. It is mentioned keeping it would show readers where it is. ---- Patar knight - ^chat/_{contributions} 16:05, 13 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep: mentioned at target, info easily verifiable [11]. – Uanfala (talk) 12:54, 17 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was delete. -- Tavix ^(talk) 17:05, 14 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Internet Music Video Database → Music  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

Not mentioned in target. - CHAMPION ^{(talk) (contributions) (logs)} 05:08, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete per nom. AngusWOOF (bark • sniff) 16:30, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was delete. -- Tavix ^(talk) 17:05, 14 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Music And Musical Instruments → Music  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

WP:XY Implausible search term. - CHAMPION ^{(talk) (contributions) (logs)} 05:07, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete See also Wikipedia:Redirects_for_discussion/Log/2016_July_29#Begging_And_Beggars where most of these were deleted except for book titles. AngusWOOF (bark • sniff) 16:38, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete - no use at all. DBaK (talk) 22:03, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was speedy delete per the creator's request below. Hut 8.5 20:49, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Us dem → Democratic Party (United States)  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

WP:ASTONISH. Makes me think of "us" and "them". Also implausible for the target. Just too many changes. Mr. Guye (talk) 02:05, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete not a common abbreviation, and incorrect capitalization (but that alone is not a reason I would usually vote to delete a redirect]]. I'll note that US Rep and Us rep do not exist, but AFAIA, that is a more common abbreviation for "US Representative]] rather than "Republican". - CHAMPION ^{(talk) (contributions) (logs)} 02:09, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete per nom. I see plenty of uses for Dem in news articles but not combined with US like that. AngusWOOF (bark • sniff) 16:42, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete, as the author of this page (years and years ago), it virtually has no usage. Also, other uses per nom. CTF83! 19:29, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was retarget to Help:Searching. -- Tavix ^(talk) 17:04, 14 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Search Wikipedia → Special:Search  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

Not sure if this is needed since it is a cross namespace soft redirect to a special page, and the main way people would get to it is by searching for it in the search box, making it a duplicate. TonyBallioni (talk) 22:39, 29 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep and re Delete - I really hate the XNR-in-principle argument wherever it is, but the "searching for the search function" is pretty solid. Ok. I'll bite. Redirecting to Help:Searching actually seems like a pretty good solution. TimothyJosephWood 23:05, 29 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep Delete this one - you'd have to use the search box to see it anyway. Create Advanced search to redirect to the special page, as it is not at all obvious how to get there. – Train2104 (t • c) 00:19, 30 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Changing my !vote - just realized that "Search Wikipedia" verbatim is the prefill text in the search box. In the event of a browser or script malfunction, that text could end up becoming the search term. – Train2104 (t • c) 01:08, 30 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep, since users may not understand that this is a search box. I could picture little kids entering "Search Wikipedia" into the search box just to see what happens. UpsandDowns1234 00:47, 30 March 2017 (UTC)— Preceding unsigned comment added by UpsandDowns1234 (talk • contribs) 00:46, 30 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete. It's a WP:XNR and it was created only 25 minutes before it was nominated here. Might as well get rid of these before we start seeing arguments for redirects such as View history being created. The nominated redirect is not an article or is related to any specific article, and thus should be deleted. I mean, editors would literally have to type "Search Wikipedia" into the bar that already says "Search Wikipedia" to even trigger this redirect. Or, at Special:Search, searching for Search Wikipedia would return the reader to where they already are, possibly causing confusion. For these reasons, I really don't see this redirect as helpful at all. Steel1943 (talk) 03:38, 30 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

  Also, I oppose "Retarget to Help:Searching" (but I oppose "keep" more) since that target is also not an article. In fact, one would think that Wikipedia's search function itself is notable in one way or another. I skimmed over the article Wikipedia a bit, and I couldn't find an appropriate section to retarget this redirect. In fact, at this point, I'm essentially convinced that this redirect should be deleted per WP:REDLINK unless an appropriate target in the article namespace (even if it's a section of another article) is found. Steel1943 (talk) 16:56, 30 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep, the page exactly matches the search box filler text. UpsandDowns1234 18:08, 30 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Is this a response to my comment? I'm unclear on this because I've already presented my stance on why I disagree about how that is helpful. Steel1943 (talk) 21:53, 30 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Speedy delete it's not working, obviously a failed G2 test. Cabayi (talk) 07:12, 30 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]
• Retarget to Help:Searching which is the target most likely to be helpful to the people using this redirect - very new users who want to know how to search (better) and haven't yet learned about namespaces. Thryduulf (talk) 08:44, 30 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep but retarget, as suggested by Thryduulf. While the idea behind it is quite a good one, its present form it is not going to be useful to any normal user of the encyclopaedia (not an editor), as it just displays a "soft redirect" message, rather than actually taking the user to the search box, and most people won't know what that means. I thought a hard redirect would work, but it doesn't. However, Thryduulf's suggestion is likely to be helpful to helpful to such users. If this suggestion is not accepted then it has to be delete, since in its present form it is not helpful. The editor who uses the pseudonym "JamesBWatson" (talk) 09:22, 30 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose keeping this as a {{soft redirect}}. There are only four transclusions of Template:Soft redirect in the mainspace, all of which are currently listed at RfD, none of which are likely to be retained. — Godsy ^(TALK_CONT) 21:39, 30 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was Speedy deleted. by admin User:Kurykh (non-admin closure) - CHAMPION ^{(talk) (contributions) (logs)} 00:03, 7 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Tsang (surname) (disambiguation) → Tsang  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

Unnecessary and potentially confusing double disambiguation, given that surname pages are usually SIAs, not disambiguations. -- Tavix ^(talk) 01:08, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Retarget to Tsang (surname) and tag as {{R from incorrect name}}. More specific target. The target is not technically a disambiguation, so we need to tag the redirect as from an incorrect name.--Mr. Guye (talk) 02:12, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

And what would be the benefit for doing this? That doesn't mitigate the confusion whatsoever. -- Tavix ^(talk) 02:30, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

How is this still confusing?--Mr. Guye (talk) 03:20, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

You're wanting to retarget a redirect that ends in "(disambiguation)" to a page that's not a disambiguation. -- Tavix ^(talk) 03:29, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

When I created the page I set it to Tsang (surname), but a bot edited. I am not sure how we could implement your solution without dealing with the bot. Emir of Wikipedia (talk) 20:14, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete, WP:RFD#D2 confusing bordering on nonsense. Tsang (disambiguation) also -> plain Tsang, and that is marked as a disambiguation page, not a surname page (correctly). That lists Tsang (surname), correctly. "Tsang (surname) (disambiguation)" implies that we have not just one Tsang (surname) page, but several, with a DAB page to take you to the one you want. But we don't have that, we don't have Tsang (Chinese surname) and Tsang (Tibetan surname) as examples I just made up. There's no need for it, it's just confusing to imply that we have more than one page about this surname when we don't. Si Trew (talk) 07:30, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]
• Creator delete Bot edited the redirect, fixing a non-existent double redirect. Emir of Wikipedia (talk) 08:32, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks User:Emir of Wikipedia, taking to CSD under WP:G7 referring back to here. If the bot causes nonsense, we should disable the bot until it is fixed. Si Trew (talk) 12:11, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Si Trew, I removed the {{Db-g7}} tag since Mr. Guye expressed an opinion in this discussion other than deletion. Steel1943 (talk) 14:13, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete. This is nonsensical redirect. older ≠ wiser 11:45, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete. I definitely sympathize with Mr. Guye's viewpoint on the potential usefulness of having "X (disambiguation)" redirects target SIAs (debated multiple times in numerous places recently), but the double parenthetical makes this unlikely to be useful to anyone. ---- Patar knight - ^chat/_{contributions} 20:40, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]
• I tagged it for speedy, obvious nonsense not worth discussion, there can only be one Tang (surname) and only a bot wouldn't know that. Siuenti (씨유엔티) 20:46, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Well, this is Tsang (surname) not Tang (surname), but thanks for taking WP:CSD#D1. Just to add salt to the fire, Tang (Chinese surname) -> Tang (surname), which is redundant but harmless, I suppose, yet implies that we also have Tang (German surname) or whatever; then we would need Tang (surname) (disambiguation). Si Trew (talk) 21:08, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

We would never need double disambiguation. Such case would be an WP:INCOMPDAB. -- Tavix ^(talk) 22:04, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Indeed. Si Trew (talk) 22:42, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete. One or two disambiguators are usually enough, but having two disambiguators like that really lowers the chances of it being a common search term. ToThAc (talk) 22:17, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete because nobody is going to come along and randomly type that into the search bar. Exemplo347 (talk) 22:51, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The result of the discussion was keep. There's consensus that the abbreviation is commonly used and warrants having a redirect. The nominator's rationale that it is ambiguous doesn't appear to have received support. (non-admin closure) – Uanfala (talk) 11:59, 16 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Texas Gov. → Governor of Texas  (talk · links · history · stats)     [ Closure: //delete ] 

Ambiguous abbreviation, could also point to Government of Texas. - CHAMPION ^{(talk) (contributions) (logs)} 00:33, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment The other related redirects are Illinois Gov., Oklahoma Gov., and Pennsylvania Gov. All target a Governor-related article or list and all were created by WhisperToMe. -- Tavix ^(talk) 01:39, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

•  Note:→WhisperToMe, your name was invoked. ---Mr. Guye (talk) 02:56, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@Mr. Guye: That's an unnecessary comment as WhisperToMe has already been notified of this discussion, see User talk:WhisperToMe#Texas Gov. listed at Redirects for discussion. -- Tavix ^(talk) 03:00, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I created them since many newspapers abbreviate governor as "Gov." Example: http://www.dallasnews.com/news/texas-politics/2017/01/20/decrying-sanctuary-cities-texas-gov-gregabbott-threatens-cut-millions-travis-county - If it's better to make them disambiguation pages, that's fine. It may be good to consult style guides to see if there are particular times to use "Gov."

• For example the Associated Press style guide mentions "Gov." as being an abbreviation for governor: "For example, Dr., Gov., Lt. Gov., Rep., the Rev. and Sen. are required before a person’s full name when they occur outside a direct quotation."https://owl.english.purdue.edu/owl/resource/735/02/

WhisperToMe (talk) 06:38, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

But honorifics come before a person's name, in English. That would be "Gov. Texas" not "Texas Gov.", just as all the letters come after my name and not before it. I think we need more than that the abbreviation is used, but that generally in print the whole phrase is used, and not, e.g. the red "Gov. Texas". It's usually a bit of WP:PEACOCK to use these honorifcs anyway, Albert Einstein is thus and not all the jots and tittles he no doubt had before and after his name. Si Trew (talk) 12:16, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

From the source quoted: "For example, Dr., Gov., Lt. Gov., Rep., the Rev. and Sen. are required before a person’s full name". Before their full name. That does not apply here to Texas, it is neither before, nor Texas' full name (which is irrelevant), nor the Governor of Texas' full name. Irrelevant to here. These honorifics apply to people not their roles, perhaps with the exception of Mr. President. Si Trew (talk) 12:23, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Newspapers have used the format "Texas Gov." for "Texas Governor" and "Oklahoma Gov." for "Oklahoma Governor" - Examples:

• Decrying 'sanctuary cities,' Texas Gov. Greg Abbott threatens to cut millions to Travis County" - The Dallas Morning News
• Oklahoma gov. calls for resignation of senator accused of child prostitution." from Associated Press at 40/29 News (and the first line: "Oklahoma Governor Mary Fallin is calling for the resignation of Sen. Ralph Shortey after child prostitution charges were filed against him on Thursday.")

While within most formal literature things are fully spelled out, abbreviations are used in newspaper headlines as they take up less space. Journalism has its own set of conventions and Wikipedians need to familiarize themselves with them.

I made these headlines because newspapers can, and do, write the state job titles in that format, and readers who type in the name into the URL space need to be directed to the right place.

WhisperToMe (talk) 17:34, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

That's true, of course, I was just saying that the given link to the given style guide is irrelevant because it doesn't cover these cases, it covers the cases where the full name of the representative is put in print, and that doesn't apply here.

I saw, when I checked it, that the style guide has its own conventions such as putting section headings all in lowercase, but I doubt we would follow that advice here and tear up our own dear WP:MOS. The quoted style guide is just irrelevant for our purposes.

It's not really a case of Headline language but, yes, one of brevity when people are familiar on a subject. I still feel that really if you see "Texas Gov. George W. Bush" you are more likely to search for George W. Bush than you are for Texas Gov., or if you are looking for information about "Mary Fallin" then you don't search for "Oklahoma Gov." or OK Gov or whatnot. I you want to know about Theresa May you don't type in MP or Rt. Hon. even though they are part of her formal title (as is Lord, technically). In British newspapers the trend generally seems not to list titles anyway, although the BBC usually do on political programmes and in the straplines at the bottom of the screen on news interviews. Si Trew (talk) 20:44, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment: texas.gov is the website for the government of Texas (.gov suffix being short for "government"). I find it humorous that the website for the governor of Texas is gov.texas.gov. The prefix and suffix are both "gov", with the "gov" meaning different things. -- Tavix ^(talk) 20:59, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Hehehe, yeah. And why did people write "Fuck Dubya" on toilet walls? Because they couldn't be bothered to write "Fuck the Governer of the Government of the State of Texas". Si Trew (talk) 21:25, 6 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• Texas Gov. Is la legit redirect, because that is what people will type who are too ____ to type out governor of Texas L3X1 (distant write) 00:17, 7 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep as valid short form. ---- Patar knight - ^chat/_{contributions} 14:14, 14 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page.