Langbahn Team – Weltmeisterschaft

Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Eurasian Blackcap/archive1

The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was promoted by Ian Rose 10:02, 19 May 2013 (UTC) [1].[reply]

Eurasian Blackcap

Eurasian Blackcap (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)

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Nominator(s): Jimfbleak - talk to me? 06:13, 22 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

What's not to like about a bird that can spend the winter living on Christmas cake? This attractive warbler is common and widespread in Europe, and a favourite subject for researchers, so for once I have to decide what to put in, rather than scratching around for info on obscure African swallows. I think it's comprehensive, but there is a large amount of material I haven't used if you spot an omission. Jimfbleak - talk to me? 06:13, 22 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Image check - all OK (own work, geograph project). Sources and authors provided.

  • File:John_Clare.jpg - PD-art usage is OK following a WMF statement (tweaked tag accordingly).
  • (optional) I am all for short captions, but you could add a little bit more context info in some of the 1-word captions. A few random suggestions: the adult female (point out the distinctive reddish-brown cap?), the eggs (maybe texture or hatching time), the chicks (1-2 weeks of feeding?). GermanJoe (talk) 10:34, 22 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Caption expanded now Jimfbleak - talk to me? 11:57, 22 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I'll take a look.

  • "The Blackcap breeds in much of Europe, western Asia and northwestern Africa, its preferred habitat being mature deciduous woodland." Comma splice?
tweaked with "and" Jimfbleak - talk to me? 12:18, 22 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • "ancient species pair" Do we have an article to link to?
Now linked Jimfbleak - talk to me? 12:07, 22 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • "is a simple alteration between" Do you mean alternation?
Aaarrrgh, yes. Jimfbleak - talk to me? 11:57, 22 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • "Both species have a quiet subsong" Do we have a link? Alternatively, an explanation of what a subsong is?
Added a gloss, it's a muted version of the full song Jimfbleak - talk to me? 12:07, 22 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • What does "churring" mean?
Reworded as "low trill" Jimfbleak - talk to me? 12:07, 22 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • "In Africa, habitats include cultivation" Can "cultivation" be used as a noun to refer to "cultivated land"?
It can, and is in the source, but changed to your better wording Jimfbleak - talk to me? 12:07, 22 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • "H. Parabelopolskyi" Worth a link? Why have you capitalised the specific name?
Fixed and linked Jimfbleak - talk to me? 12:18, 22 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • "Isospora ashmoonensis" Again, worth a link? Don't be scared of redlinks
linked Jimfbleak - talk to me? 11:57, 22 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • "Various orchestral instruments represent the Blackcap's song, which symbolises St Francis, in Messiaen's opera, Saint François d'Assise.[56]" Slightly clumsy sentence
I've really struggled writing this article to get this bit to both make sense and be readable. Now In Messiaen's opera, Saint François d'Assise, the orchestration is based on bird song. St Francis himself is represented by the Blackcap. Any better? Jimfbleak - talk to me? 12:19, 22 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The commas aren't right in the new sentence, but I don't quite have the vocabulary to hand to explain why. You need either "In Messiaen's opera Saint François d'Assise," or "In an opera by Messiaen, Saint François d'Assise,". Alternatively, you could make the name of the opera the subject of the sentence: "In Saint François d'Assise, an opera by Messiaen,". J Milburn (talk) 12:53, 24 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I've changed the subject as suggested. This sentence has given me more grief than all the rest of the article ): Jimfbleak - talk to me? 14:34, 24 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I made a few small fixes along the way, and I've not looked at the sources or images, but it looks great so far! J Milburn (talk) 10:56, 22 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for review, tweaks and comments Jimfbleak - talk to me? 12:18, 22 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Support based on the above fixes (delegates- while Jim and I did work on Nauru Reed Warbler together, I had nothing to do with this article). In terms of other things to put in, I'm a big fan of the culture section- some real culture, rather than unsourced lists of Family Guy trivia! If there's anything else, that would be nice- a section of poetry if we have anything written in English, for instance, would be a nice addition. J Milburn (talk) 16:39, 27 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for support. I'll see if I can find anything significant in English other than Clare, but for some reason the capinera seems to be a favourite of the Italians.

Comments by Neelix

*If "Blackcap" is the most common name for the species and this article is the primary target for that term, why is this article not called "Blackcap" instead of "Eurasian Blackcap"?

Birds often have different common names, for example Canada's Common Loon = UK Great Northern Diver. For consistency, the bird project names follow the IOC world list, even though that name may not be the most used in practice Jimfbleak - talk to me? 06:16, 5 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

*The terms "clutch" and "interspecific competition" should be linked and, preferably, explained.

Done Jimfbleak - talk to me? 06:16, 5 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The term "clutch" should be linked in its first instance in the body as well as in the lead. Neelix (talk) 03:55, 6 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Done Jimfbleak - talk to me? 13:43, 6 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

*The images require alt text.

Done, although not currently an fac requirement Jimfbleak - talk to me? 06:16, 5 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
When did that requirement subside? I believe they still make it mandatory over at FL. Neelix (talk) 03:55, 6 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

*The sentence beginning "The current genus name..." is confusing because it contains so many phrases.

Split Jimfbleak - talk to me? 06:16, 5 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

*The first instance of "Iberia" should be linked.

Done Jimfbleak - talk to me? 06:16, 5 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

*The phrase "named as the" should simply be "named the".

Done Jimfbleak - talk to me? 06:16, 5 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

*Check the article for tense consistency and accuracy; most instances of the future tense (ex. "but will start singing in January or February") should be stated in the present, and sentences should not unnecesarily switch between tenses.

I think I've got all these Jimfbleak - talk to me? 06:16, 5 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
There are still tense consistency issues, particularly with mid-sentence switches from present to future. Neelix (talk) 20:37, 6 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I've had another pass Jimfbleak - talk to me? 06:31, 7 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I have gone through and fixed the remaining tense consistency issues. Neelix (talk) 17:03, 7 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

*No paragraphs should consist of a single sentence.

I'm not sure that's mos, but done anyway Jimfbleak - talk to me? 06:16, 5 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

*Why is "leap-frog" in quotation marks?

That's how it was in the source, removed now Jimfbleak - talk to me? 06:16, 5 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

*The sentence beginning "The ready availability..." employs false parallelism; semicolons should be implemented or the sentence should be restructured. The string "crown raised, tail fanned and slow wingbeats" also employs false parallelism.

I'm not totally sure what this means, but rephrased now Jimfbleak - talk to me? 06:16, 5 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
There is still a false parallelism; see Parallelism (grammar). The phrase "particularly from bird tables" imitates a list entry. Neelix (talk) 20:37, 6 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Even after following your link, I can't see what's wrong here. It's a list of three compensatory factors, and I can't see why it's "imitating" a list. If I made it a bulleted list, it would still make sense with no change of wording. I'd be grateful if you could fix this, since I'm clearly not seeing the problem. Jimfbleak - talk to me? 06:31, 7 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The sentence is a list, and should be; there's no problem in that respect. The issue is that "particularly from bird tables" is not an entry in the list, but was grammatically treated as one. There are multiple ways of solving this issue, but I have chosen the option to implement semicolons. Please let me know if you would prefer a different solution. Neelix (talk) 17:03, 7 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

*Midsentence citations should be bundled with the corresponding end-of-sentence citations to improve flow.

That's definitely not mos or an fac requirement, in 45 FAs that's not been raised before. Nevertheless, I've been through and moved some refs where I think it improves readability without losing the connection between a fact and its ref Jimfbleak - talk to me? 06:18, 5 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Two of my recent FACs were required to bundle citations in this manner; an explanation of how to do so is outlined here. Citation-bundling improves readability and flow, but it is certainly up to the directors to determine whether or not such bundling is required. Neelix (talk) 20:37, 6 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I don't think reviewers can "require" a particular style. The only delegate requirement is that citation practice is consistent within an article. I don't like the bundled style, and I think moving several references to the end of a sentence is as far as I'm prepared to go on this Jimfbleak - talk to me? 06:31, 7 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I wish I had known that before I submitted some of my recent FACs; if you're right, it would have saved me a lot of unnecessary work. Neelix (talk) 17:03, 7 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I've seen the very occasional "oppose" where a reviewer's style suggestion isn't followed, but delegates ignore unreasonable style straitjackets. As long as there is some sort of logic, you just have to make sure you are consistent — and if you are not, woe betide when Nikkimaria scours your refs (: Jimfbleak - talk to me? 17:29, 7 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

*Commas are occasionally missing throughout the article.

I punctuate BE style, which is less comma-dense than AE. For example, Brits write "A, B and C" where a North American might have "A, B, and C". I've tweaked a couple. Any particularly ungrammatical examples left? Jimfbleak - talk to me? 06:16, 5 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
There are still missing commas. See, for example, "... wintering in gardens in Great Britain, and to a lesser extent Ireland, where formerly the Blackcap was just a summer visitor." Both "to a lesser extent" and "formerly" should be offset by commas. I do not believe that this is a BE/AE difference, but you are welcome to correct me on this point. Neelix (talk) 20:37, 6 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I've had another pass Jimfbleak - talk to me? 06:31, 7 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

*The "Cited texts" section should be called "Bibliography" to be consistent with other articles.

"Should be" seems improbable. What other articles? All my FAs, if they use this style, have "Cited texts", so do most other bird FAs. Jimfbleak - talk to me? 06:16, 5 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I have not reviewed any of your previous FACs, but "Cited texts" is a very uncommon title for a bibliography. A Google Books search reveals just over 8 thousand hits for "Cited texts" (most of which are not headings for a bibliography), just over 8 hundred thousand hits for "Works cited", and more than 55 million hits for "Bibliography". As far as I can tell, "Bibliography" is also the most common header to use for these sections in our featured articles, but I will leave that to other reviewers to decide. Neelix (talk) 20:37, 6 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
It's certainly not unusual in FAs, and I would guess that it's more common here than "Bibliography". I've seen the latter objected to at FAC because it it can be taken to mean "Further reading" rather than the source. Anyway, it's a matter of personal preference rather than Mos, so I'll stick with my usual practice Jimfbleak - talk to me? 06:31, 7 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Neelix (talk) 04:37, 5 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks so much for review and comments. I'm going to be away for a couple of days for the May Bank Holiday, but I'll deal with any outstanding issues on my return Jimfbleak - talk to me? 06:16, 5 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Support - Good fixes. Neelix (talk) 17:03, 7 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for your careful review, prose tweaks and support. Jimfbleak - talk to me? 17:29, 7 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
from the rest of the genus at a date estimated at between 12 and 16 million years ago. - flows clunkily when I read it to myself...the "at between" is odd. Unfortunately an alternative doesn't spring to mind....
The nearest relative of the Blackcap outside the sister group is believed to be the African Hill Babbler - ummmm doesn't that mean then that Sylvia is polyphyletic....?

Otherwise has buffed up rather well and on target for a shiny gold star....Casliber (talk · contribs) 12:10, 7 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

thanks for review and comments Jimfbleak - talk to me? 14:17, 7 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for support Jimfbleak - talk to me? 08:22, 10 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Support Comments by Yzx

  • birds from the colder areas of its range winter in scrub or trees from northwestern Europe south to tropical Africa -- the wording is confusing, not clear whether birds are coming from NW Europe or going to it for winter.
now winter in scrub or trees in northwestern Europe, around the Mediterranean and in tropical Africa. Jimfbleak - talk to me? 05:22, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • as being of Least Concern -- "being of" is unnecessary.
Done Jimfbleak - talk to me? 05:22, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • at a date between 12 and 16 million years ago -- "a date" is extraneous.
Done Jimfbleak - talk to me? 05:22, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Why give authorities for the subgenera?
Removed Jimfbleak - talk to me? 05:22, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • The Blackcap is a mainly grey warbler with distinctive male and female plumages -- do you mean that the bird is distinctive, or that the male and females are distinct from each other?
Done Jimfbleak - talk to me? 05:22, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • but up to 31 g (1.1 oz) for birds preparing to migrate -- missing a verb here I think.
Done Jimfbleak - talk to me? 05:22, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • neat black cap to the head -- "on the head"?
Done Jimfbleak - talk to me? 05:22, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
    • Same for and have white edges to the tail.
Done Jimfbleak - talk to me? 05:22, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • The female has a reddish-brown cap, but otherwise resembles the male, although she has a slightly browner tone to the grey of the upperparts. -- this sentence is awkward with two contrasting statements, suggest "the female resembles the male, but has a reddish-brown cap and a slightly browner tone to the grey of the upperparts."
Done Jimfbleak - talk to me? 05:22, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • but taking longer to complete, than do the adults -- "do" is extraneous
Done Jimfbleak - talk to me? 05:22, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Both species have a quiet subsong, a muted version of the full song, which is even more difficult to separate, and the Blackcap occasionally mimics the song of other birds,[19] the most frequently copied including the Garden Warbler and the Common Nightingale. -- suggest splitting into two sentences
Done Jimfbleak - talk to me? 05:22, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • compensatory factors include the ready availability of food, particularly from bird tables; a shorter migration distance; and the avoidance of the Alps and the Sahara Desert -- the use of semicolons here as super commas is a bit odd considering how they're used in the rest of the article. I think you can just use regular commas if you put "particularly from bird tables" in parentheses.
Done Jimfbleak - talk to me? 05:22, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • and isotope analysis (which enables the wintering location to be determined), -- inappropriate comma
Done Jimfbleak - talk to me? 05:22, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Mixed pairings are also genetically selected against -- "genetically" is inappropriate, since selection is acting on behavior here
Done Jimfbleak - talk to me? 08:08, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • but densities are much lower in poorer habitats such as conifer forests. -- suggest putting as separate sentence
Done Jimfbleak - talk to me? 08:08, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • mostly in towns and below 100 m (300 ft). -- should this "and" be here?
Done Jimfbleak - talk to me? 08:08, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • but occasionally at a height of up to 4.5 m (15 ft) -- the construction of this phrase doesn't match the previous one
Split into two sentences and tweaked for clarity Jimfbleak - talk to me? 10:51, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • average size 19.7 x 14.7 mm (0.78 x 0.58 in) -- is this the average size of a single egg?
Rearranged sentences to make this clear Jimfbleak - talk to me? 08:08, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • both adults sharing the duty, although only the female stays on the nest at night -- suggest putting as separate sentence
Done Jimfbleak - talk to me? 08:08, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • leaving the nest shortly before they are able to fly -- how do they leave before they can fly? Do they stay on the ground?
They clamber around the branches. Do I need to say that? It seems pretty obvious. Jimfbleak - talk to me? 08:08, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
OK, that makes sense. -- Yzx (talk) 00:48, 13 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • What's the age of first reproduction, if typical life expectancy is two years?
Says in first line of Breeding that it aged one Jimfbleak - talk to me? 08:08, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • since the Mistle Thrush, which, as its name implies, also favours that plant, tends to crush the seeds -- lots of commas makes reading disjointed
Split to two sentences and simplified Jimfbleak - talk to me? 08:08, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Fruit is also eaten, notably, cotoneaster (41% of the fruit consumed), ivy and honeysuckle, and apple is eaten if available -- comma after "notably" is unnecessary, as is "is eaten" after apple
Done Jimfbleak - talk to me? 08:08, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • On the other hand, there is considerable variation between different clutches -- this is written as a contrast when it isn't really, since it supports the previous statement about reducing cuckoo parasitism
Remove contrast Jimfbleak - talk to me? 08:08, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • The habitat and open nest of the warbler -- not sure what "habitat and open nest" are referring to
Expanded to make it clear that these make it suitable as a cuckoo host Jimfbleak - talk to me? 08:08, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • The only blood parasites found in 132 Blackcaps -- methodological detail reads odd here, suggest "parasites found in a study of Blackcaps"
Done Jimfbleak - talk to me? 10:49, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • 45.5% of males and 22.7% of females were affected -- sentences generally shouldn't start with a numeral
Done Jimfbleak - talk to me? 10:49, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • and parasitic worms may sometimes kill their host -- this seems like a non sequitur, since you've only talked about protozoa up to this point
Separate sentence now Jimfbleak - talk to me? 10:49, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • the symmetry of feather growth -- symmetry on both sides of the bird, or symmetry of individual feathers?
I checked the source, and it seems to be only the latter, tweaked to make this clear Jimfbleak - talk to me? 10:49, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • considered that the Garden Warbler eventually became a Blackcap -- not clear what this means
Added metamorphosis. I avoided this initially because the source said that Aristotle used a different word, but I couldn't understand the distinction, so it's in now. Jimfbleak - talk to me? 10:49, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • John Clare, in "The March Nightingale" describes the listener as believing that the rarer species has arrived prematurely: "He stops his own and thinks the nightingale/Hath of her monthly reckoning counted wrong". -- suggest putting as separate sentence
Done Jimfbleak - talk to me? 10:49, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Giovanni Verga's 1871 novel Storia di una capinera -- what is the relevance of this beyond the title? Does the bird figure into the plot in some way?
I probably wouldn't have put in in if it was only the title, but the Italian article explains that the background in the "Il titolo" section Jimfbleak - talk to me? 10:49, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
That the background in the section...? -- Yzx (talk) 00:48, 13 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry, just illiteracy, struck "that" in response above. I thought the fact that Verga took the capinera story as his inspiration, and explained why in some detail, was sufficient to include the novel and the films based on it. Jimfbleak - talk to me? 05:22, 13 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Which capinera story is that? Can you add more context in the article for this inspiration? -- Yzx (talk) 06:03, 13 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Oops, I only just spotted this. I've added a brief version of the story with which Verga introduces the novel and a potted plot to show its relevance. I don't think plot summaries need references, which is just as well since I don't have the book and can't speak Italian Jimfbleak - talk to me? 06:33, 15 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Folk names for the Blackcap often refer to its most obvious plumage feature, (black-headed peggy, King Harry black cap and coal hoodie), to its song, as in the "nightingale" names above, or to its choice of nesting material (Jack Straw, hay bird, hay chat and hay Jack). -- commas and parentheses are a mess here
Split into two sentences and tidied Jimfbleak - talk to me? 10:49, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • for example in Scotland and Denmark -- "for example to"?
Done Jimfbleak - talk to me? 10:49, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • such as northern Israel and the Faroes -- "such as in"
Done Jimfbleak - talk to me? 10:49, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Nice article. My comments are cosmetic issues for the most part. -- Yzx (talk) 17:53, 11 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for your review and comments. I hope that I've fixed all the issues. Jimfbleak - talk to me? 10:49, 12 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
All looks good to me. Supporting now. -- Yzx (talk) 06:42, 15 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks again, Jimfbleak - talk to me? 09:19, 15 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.
Quelle: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Featured_article_candidates/Eurasian_Blackcap/archive1