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This is a collection of discussions on the deletion of articles related to China. It is one of many deletion lists coordinated by WikiProject Deletion sorting. Anyone can help maintain the list on this page.

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For further information see Wikipedia's deletion policy and WP:AfD for general information about Articles for Deletion, including a list of article deletions sorted by day of nomination.

This list is also part of the larger list of deletion debates related to Asia.

Archived discussions (starting from September 2007) may be found at:
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China

Wong Weng Hei

Wong Weng Hei (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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There doesn't appear to be any WP:SIGCOV for WP:NSPORT. CNC (talk) 18:10, 28 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Karl Dominik

Karl Dominik (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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No WP:SUSTAINED notability here and highly promotional Amigao (talk) 17:20, 27 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Mavis Ma

Mavis Ma (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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This article seems to be written in a highly NPOV style, it almost reads like a political attack ad. I'm also not so sure this person even meets GNG and should not be considered notable through their brother(Although it is possible that I'm missing articles not in English). GoldMiner24 Talk 04:52, 27 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  • Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Politicians, Women, China, Hong Kong, Taiwan, Massachusetts, and New York. WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 05:21, 27 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep: I agree with the nom that the article currently documents too many "controversies" which potentially violates NPOV. Some minor incidents, such as the subject being scolded by her father in public or her endorsements of candidates, are totally UNDUE and can certainly be removed. However, I believe most content can stay, as much of the subject's political career involved dirty work, supported by numerous sources and opinion pieces like the one from Apple Daily by Neil Peng (source 33). Although NPOV is a serious concern, AFD is not cleanup, and I do not think notability is an issue for the subject. Currently, there are more than 30 sources listed in the article, with even more in the zhwiki one. I scanned through the first 10 sources, and sources 2, 4, 5, 6, 9, and 10 all provided SIGCOV on the subject and are certainly enough to pass GNG. Not to mention a simple Google News search can already yield many full articles about the subject, such as these articles from Central News Agency[2] and ETtoday[3]. I also think that her case regarding the violation of conflict of interest should be sufficient to meet WP:PERP. —Prince of Erebor（The Book of Mazarbul） 06:22, 27 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep per the significant coverage in multiple independent reliable sources. The subject passes Wikipedia:Notability (people)#Basic criteria, which says:

    People are presumed notable if they have received significant coverage in multiple published secondary sources that are reliable, intellectually independent of each other, and independent of the subject.

    • If the depth of coverage in any given source is not substantial, then multiple independent sources may be combined to demonstrate notability; trivial coverage of a subject by secondary sources is not usually sufficient to establish notability.

    Sources

    1. The sources listed by Prince of Erebor (talk · contribs) and those already in the article.
    2. Li, Hsin-i 李心怡 (2008-02-20). "馬以南作風大膽 拆掉馬英九包裝" [[Ma Yinan's Bold Style: Unveiling the True Image of Ma Ying-jeou]. New Taiwan Weekly [zh] (in Chinese). No. 622. Archived from the original on 2024-12-30. Retrieved 2024-12-30.

      The article notes: "原來，馬以南一九六二年考上台大外文系之後曾轉到植病學系，因此延畢一年；原來，馬以南在一九六六年曾替一考生代考大學聯考擔任「槍手」；原來，「槍手案」爆發後，檢方以陳姓考生未考取大學為由，未起訴馬以南，連罪證確鑿的偽造文書罪都沒有，也沒有被台大退學；原來，馬以南在案子起訴前已早一步前往美國求學、申請綠卡、當美國公民；原來，中央日報刊登所有涉案人詳細資料時，可以獨漏馬以南的犯罪事實、代價金額與知情家長姓名等資料；原來，馬英九一家享盡特權，媒體、司法遇到他們都沒轍；原來，所謂家教甚嚴的家庭，竟是教出說謊、詐欺、涉嫌貪污的子女。"

      From Google Translate: "It turns out that Ma Yin-nan, after being admitted to the Department of Foreign Languages at National Taiwan University in 1962, later transferred to the Department of Plant Pathology, which caused him to delay his graduation by one year. It turns out that in 1966, Ma Yin-nan acted as a "gunman" (substitute test-taker) for a student during the university entrance exams. It turns out that after the "gunman case" broke, the prosecutor did not indict Ma Yin-nan, citing that the student (Chen) did not get into a university, and even though there was solid evidence of forgery, he was not charged with falsifying documents, nor was he expelled from National Taiwan University. It turns out that before the case was prosecuted, Ma Yin-nan had already gone to the United States to study, applied for a green card, and became a U.S. citizen. It turns out that when the Central Daily News published detailed information about all those involved in the case, they conveniently omitted Ma Yin-nan's criminal facts, the amount of money involved, and the names of the parents who were aware of the situation. It turns out that the Ma Ying-jeou family enjoyed special privileges, with the media and the judiciary unable to do anything in the face of their influence. It turns out that the so-called "strict family upbringing" actually produced children who lied, committed fraud, and were suspected of corruption."

    3. Peng, Neil (2013-10-25). "【馮光遠專欄】馬英九的門神" [【Feng Kuan-yuan's Column】Ma Ying-jeou's Gatekeeper]]. Apple Daily (in Chinese). Archived from the original on 2015-09-24. Retrieved 2024-12-30.

      The article notes: "馬以南之所以又冒出來，因為她這個門神，事業做得還真大，除了增進身體健康的一堆藥廠請她守門，戕害身體健康的假油業者也找上她，可見外戚在今日台灣是同時受到健康跟不健康企業的愛戴。"

      From Google Translate: "The reason why Ma Yinan appears again is because she is a doorkeeper and has a really big career. In addition to a lot of pharmaceutical companies that improve health, she is hired to guard the door. She is also approached by fake oil companies that harm health. It can be seen that her relatives are in Today, Taiwan is loved by both healthy and unhealthy companies."

    4. Tsai, Ching-hsuan 蔡靚萱 (2010-02-03). "超完美箭靶 馬以南" [An Almost Perfect Target: Mavis Ma]. Yam [zh] (in Chinese). Archived from the original on 2014-12-21. Retrieved 2024-12-30.

      The article notes: "事實上，自從馬英九於二○○八年當選總統以後，過去在助選場合、黨務、生技製藥界相當活躍的馬以南，幾乎是被迫自縛雙手、低調過日子。不但辭去民間公司職務，曾高票當選國民黨中央委員的她，在國民黨擬定○九年中央委員候選名單時，因馬英九特別請黨主席吳伯雄「不要把我大姊放進去」，宣告正式退出黨務。"

      From Google Translate: "In fact, since Ma Ying-jeou was elected president in 2008, Ma Yinan, who used to be very active in campaign events, party affairs, and the biotech and pharmaceutical industry, has been almost forced to tie his hands and live a low-key life. Not only did she resign from a private company, but she was once elected as a member of the KMT Central Committee with a high vote. When the KMT was drawing up the candidate list for the 2009 Central Committee, Ma Ying-jeou specifically asked party chairman Wu Boxiong to "don't include my eldest sister in the list." She announced her official withdrawal from the party."

    There is sufficient coverage in reliable sources to allow Mavis Ma (traditional Chinese: 馬以南; simplified Chinese: 马以南) to pass Wikipedia:Notability#General notability guideline, which requires "significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject".

    Cunard (talk) 11:37, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]



Gate.io

AfDs for this article:
Gate.io (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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An article on a crypto-exchange company, created in March after a previous instance was deleted by AfD in February. Although this instance is not a WP:G4 repost, the text covers much the same ground and most of the references were available for consideration in the Jan 24 AfD. Since then there is a pros-and-cons Business Insider product review, though it is marked Paid non-client promotion. I am unconvinced that the available coverage meets WP:CORPDEPTH - and the special considerations for Crypto - so it seems appropriate to open a discussion on whether or not to overturn the Feb 24 AfD decision as to attained notability. AllyD (talk) 15:57, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

St. Francis of Assisi's English Primary School

AfDs for this article:
St. Francis of Assisi's English Primary School (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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Lack of notability. Seems like a totally unremarkable primary school, and schools are not inherently notable. TheLongTone (talk) 15:46, 28 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Keep
https://www.examiner.org.hk/2020/02/21/the-last-chinese-style-architecture-st-francis-of-assisi-church-and-school-in-shek-kip-mei/news/hongkong/ This article talks about how the school is one of the last remaining built in the architectural style of Chinese renaissance in the 1950s, I think this deserves recognition and I apologise for not including this in the article Ilovefood123123 (talk) 04:00, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
That is the only non primary source in the article, so even were we to accept it, we are not at a keep yet. But it is interesting because it does cover the school but it spends more time on the church, and it treats the church and school as a complex. Although I am not seeing notability for the school as a school, that would be an excellent source under NGEO for the complex of church plus school, and an article that focuses on the architecture. Similarly it is also treated in Building Catholic Churches in Hong Kong. I cannot find an article on the church and school, but that would appear to be the encyclopaedic subject here. Sirfurboy🏄 (talk) 11:06, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Besides from this, I have mentioned previously that this is a local English-teaching primary school, that also teaches French and Japanese on the side. This is likely to be the only primary school that operate in this mode in Hong Kong and somehow in my opinion gives the school notability. Ilovefood123123 (talk) 14:42, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
That's all well and good, but what does that have to do with whether or not this school meets notability standards? Notability =/= importance. 4.37.252.50 (talk) 16:13, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Doesn't Wikipedia exists to share notable info, not only about the latest Pokemon movie or the shoe size of the hottest actress of the year but also the information about small places that otherwise people would never know about? If is like other similar old schools I've encountered then they might participate in many local, regional and national activities but without doing much promotion about it, just teaching individuals who later become notable. Yeah, this is all speculation but wanted to invite you, to think about how sometimes is much more worthwhile to share info about something, or someone, that doesn't care to be known and rather is dedicated to their own craft. Bit-Pasta (talk) 16:44, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The words in blue are links. Writing an encyclopedia article isn't like writing an essay. When one writes an encyclopedia article, all they are doing is reporting on what others have written in reliable sources independent of the subject. The standards for notability are based on the availability of such sources, a somewhat objective standard; rather than the subjective standard of what people think is important. 4.37.252.50 (talk) 22:08, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The book and article were both written by Ayako Fukushima, so we currently have a single source for notability. Helpful Raccoon (talk) 17:27, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Just curious: how did you determine that? 4.37.252.50 (talk) 22:17, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The article has the author at the bottom, and Google Books always lists the book author. Helpful Raccoon (talk) 22:30, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry, I thought by article you meant the Wikipedia article at hand. But I'm only seeing the one independent source, the article by the author mentioned. At this point, my !vote would be a Weak keep, based on the level of detail found in that article. 4.37.252.50 (talk) 22:56, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yeah, I have to consciously distinguish "Wikipedia article" and "source article" when commenting in discussions. A single source isn't enough to pass WP:NORG though. Helpful Raccoon (talk) 01:41, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Would you somehow be more inclined to keep an article on the architectural building itself instead of the school, seeing that there are more sources based on that. Something that @Sirfurboy has brought up on. Ilovefood123123 (talk) 01:58, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Here’s a paper written by the same person from the previous source on the topic. https://catalog.lib.kyushu-u.ac.jp/opac_download_md/7172136/85_453.pdf Ilovefood123123 (talk) 02:01, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for finding these sources, but sources by multiple authors are usually needed to pass WP:NORG. Helpful Raccoon (talk) 03:07, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
If the article is kept based on the provided sources, I would consider a move to "St. Francis of Assisi Church and School". Helpful Raccoon (talk) 03:11, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep per the significant coverage in multiple independent reliable sources. The subject passes Wikipedia:Notability (organizations and companies)#Schools, which says:

    All universities, colleges and schools, including high schools, middle schools, primary (elementary) schools, and schools that only provide a support to mainstream education must either satisfy the notability guidelines for organizations, the general notability guideline, or both. For-profit educational organizations and institutions are considered commercial organizations and must satisfy those criteria. (See also WP:SCHOOLOUTCOMES)

    Sources
    1. Lee, Sau-shan 李綉珊 (2024-12-16). 航拍-AI製作70周年校慶片媲美電影? "最強校慶片｜聖方濟各英文小學出動200師生共舞　航拍+AI製作70周年校慶片媲美電影" [Ultimate School Anniversary Video｜St. Francis of Assisi's English Primary School Brings Together 200 Teachers and Students for a Dance Performance, Aerial Footage and AI-Generated 70th Anniversary Video Rivals a Movie]. Hong Kong Economic Times (in Chinese). Archived from 航拍-AI製作70周年校慶片媲美電影? the original on 2024-12-30. Retrieved 2024-12-30.

      The article notes: "聖方濟各英文小學（St. Francis of Assisi's English Primary School） 是位於深水埗區的一間私立全日小學，學費為$54,900（分十期繳交），學校面積約2,000平方米，屬於男女校。聖方濟各英文小學創立於1955年，學校的宗教背景是天主教，辦學團體為天主教香港教區。課外活動以多元化為重點，包括資優教育抽離式課程、合唱團、男女童軍、美勞和手工藝班及各項運動興趣小組等等。聖方濟各英文小學名人明星校友，包括楊受成弟弟楊海成、香港電影監製、財務總監李恩霖、香港資深傳媒人陳志雲、香港作曲及填詞人于逸堯@人山人海、香港填詞人陳詠謙、香港男藝人崔建邦、王宗堯等。"

      From Google Translate: "St. Francis of Assisi's English Primary School is a private full-day primary school located in Sham Shui Po District. The tuition fee is $54,900 (paid in ten installments). The school area is about 2,000 square meters. It is a boys' and girls' school. St. Francis of Assisi's English Primary School was founded in 1955. The religious background of the school is Catholic, and the school running body is the Catholic Diocese of Hong Kong. Extracurricular activities focus on diversity, including gifted education pull-out courses, choirs, boy and girl scouts, art and craft classes, various sports interest groups, etc. Celebrity star alumni of St. Francis of Assisi's English Primary School include Yang Shoucheng's brother Yang Haicheng, Hong Kong film producer and financial director Li Enlin, Hong Kong senior media person Chen Zhiyun, Hong Kong composer and lyricist Yu Yiyao@人山人海, Hong Kong lyricist Chen Yongqian, Hong Kong male artist Cui Kin-bang, Wang Zongyao et al."

    2. Joanne (2016-07-21). "校園速報" [Campus News]. Oriental Sunday [zh] (in Chinese). p. K18.

      The article notes: "深水埗區的私立小學—聖方濟各英文小學，歷年升中派位理想，大多數學生都獲派英中，當中逾半考入Band 1中學，包括九龍華仁書院及長沙灣天主英文教中學等名校。學校一直著重學生的中英文能力，每級英文教深一年，數學則教深半年，中文則以國語授課，小三開始有外語堂，提供日文及法文等第三語言課堂，學習模式偏向傳統，紀律亦較嚴謹，較適合一些自學自律能力高的小朋友。有興建報讀的家長，就要密切留意報名詳情。"

      From Google Translate: "St. Francis of Assisi English Primary School, a private primary school in Sham Shui Po district, has been ideal in allocating places to secondary schools over the years. Most students have been allocated to English-medium secondary schools, and more than half of them have been admitted to Band 1 secondary schools, including Kowloon Wah Yan College and Cheung Sha Wan Catholic English School. Middle schools and other prestigious schools. The school has always focused on students' Chinese and English proficiency. Each level is taught in English for one year, and in mathematics for half a year. Chinese is taught in Mandarin. Starting from the third grade, there is a foreign language class, which provides third language classes such as Japanese and French. The learning model is more traditional. The discipline is also more rigorous and is more suitable for children with high self-learning and self-discipline abilities. Parents who are interested in enrolling in the school should pay close attention to the registration details."

    3. "聖方濟各英文小學" [St. Francis of Assisi's English Primary School]. Kung Kao Po (in Chinese). 2016-06-01. Archived from the original on 2024-12-30. Retrieved 2024-12-30.

      The article notes: "聖方濟各英文小學推行資優教育十八年，為資優生提供更合他們的課程，並在課外得到更多發展機會。位於石硤尾的聖方濟各英文小學每年安排約二百多名學生接受額外的資優教育培訓，負責資優教育的教師劉秀明早前對本報說，學校為學習能力相對高的學生提供資優培育，並舉辦相關學習活動。"

      From Google Translate: "St. Francis of Assisi English Primary School has been implementing gifted education for 18 years, providing gifted students with courses that are more suitable for them and providing them with more development opportunities outside of class. St. Francis of Assisi English Primary School in Shek Kip Mei arranges for more than 200 students to receive additional gifted education training every year. Liu Xiuming, a teacher in charge of gifted education, told this newspaper earlier that the school provides students with relatively high learning abilities. Provide gifted education and organise relevant learning activities."

    4. Cheng, Mei 曾媚; Leung, Wing-lok 梁永樂 (2006-10-11). "私小兩成資優生全方位栽培 港欠訓練系統恐中學現斷層" [Private Schools' Gifted Students Receive Comprehensive Training, but Hong Kong Lacks a Training System, Fearing a Gap in Secondary Education]. Ming Pao (in Chinese). p. A14.

      The article notes: "著名私立小學聖方濟各英文小學全校有900名學生，當中逾200人被辨識為資優生，資優比率多達逾兩成，校方動用全校資源，開設資優課程。 ... 聖方濟各英文小學是本港最早推行資優教育的小學之一，已有12年經驗。校長梁偉才說，該校家長可自行讓子女接受專業的智商測驗(IQtest)，若測驗顯示學生智商高於130分，他們就自動進入資優「人才庫」。現時「人才庫」有200人，當中約100人憑高智商「入庫」，另外60多人由教師觀察推薦，其餘約30人是學業成績最佳的10%學生。"

      From Google Translate: "St. Francis of Assisi English Primary School, a well-known private elementary school, has 900 students. More than 200 of them are identified as gifted students, with the gifted rate reaching more than 20%. The school uses the entire school's resources to provide gifted courses. ... St. Francis English Primary School is one of the earliest primary schools in Hong Kong to implement gifted education, with 12 years of experience. Principal Liang Weicai said that parents of the school can have their children take a professional IQ test on their own. If the test shows that the student's IQ is higher than 130 points, they will automatically enter the gifted "talent pool." There are currently 200 people in the "talent pool", of which about 100 are "entered" with high IQ, more than 60 are recommended by teachers through observation, and the remaining 30 are among the top 10% of students with the best academic performance."

    5. Chau, Tsz-yuen 丘梓媛 (2005-10-03). "聖方濟各資優生比率高" [St. Francis School Has a High Ratio of Gifted Students]. Sing Tao Daily (in Chinese). p. F2.

      The article notes: "本港並無專門訓練資優生的學校，而推行資優教育達十二年的聖方濟各英文小學，可能是有資優小朋友家長的一個選擇。 該校校長梁偉才表示，現時全校千多位學生中，智力超過一百三十的資優生超過一百五十人，很可能是全港最高資優生比率的小學。"

      From Google Translate: "St. Francis of Assisi English Primary School, a private primary school with 12 years of experience in gifted teaching, with 95% of its students admitted to English secondary schools, has now distributed primary one admission applications. ... There are no schools in Hong Kong that specialise in training gifted students. St. Francis of Assisi English Primary School, which has been promoting gifted education for 12 years, may be an option for parents of gifted children. The principal of the school, Leung Wai-chai, said that among the more than 1,000 students in the school, there are more than 150 gifted students with intelligence exceeding 130, making it probably the primary school with the highest ratio of gifted students in Hong Kong."

    6. "聖方濟各英文小學　全面推行資優教育" [St. Francis of Assisi's English Primary School Fully Implements Gifted Education]. Hong Kong Economic Times (in Chinese). 2005-01-28. Archived from the original on 2024-12-30. Retrieved 2024-12-30.

      The article notes: "看準了這一點，10 年前起，聖方濟各英文小學，嘗試在校內推行普及資優教育，務求把孩子的潛能，全數發掘出來！ ... 師資方面：目前該校有12位老師，他們都曾在馮漢柱資優中心接受訓練。另外，校方不時邀請本港大學以及台灣資優研究專家到校分享，拓闊老師的知識層面。... 該校亦著重英語教學，其課程較一般的學校高一級。此外，常識科教學亦是以英語授課，及至小三時，數學科亦採用英語教授。該校有兩位以英語為母語的外籍教師，以英語教學。而為營造英語環境，校園集會時以英語進行；校內的通告備有中英文版本、校園內的壁報絕大部分為英文資料。再者每一個星期亦設有 Special Monday，當天所有學生，要以英語溝通。"

      From Google Translate: "With this in mind, St. Francis of Assisi English Primary School has been trying to implement universal gifted education in schools since 10 years ago, in order to fully explore the potential of children! ... In terms of teachers: There are currently 12 teachers in the school, all of whom have received training at the Feng Hanzhu Gifted Center. In addition, the school invites gifted research experts from local universities and Taiwan from time to time to the school to share their knowledge to broaden the knowledge of teachers. ... The school also focuses on English teaching, and its courses are one level higher than those of ordinary schools. In addition, general knowledge subjects are also taught in English, and in primary three, mathematics is also taught in English. The school has two native English-speaking foreign teachers who teach in English. In order to create an English-speaking environment, campus assemblies are held in English; campus announcements are available in Chinese and English, and most posters on campus are in English. In addition, there is a Special Monday every week, and all students on that day must communicate in English."

    7. Wong, Ming-fong 王明芳 (2021-08-23). 聖方濟各英文小學小一新生名額約160個 "【小一入學】重視語文必修日文或法文　聖方濟各英文小學小一新生名額約160個" [【Primary 1 Enrollment】Emphasis on Language Requirements—Japanese or French as a Compulsory Subject, Around 160 Spots for New Primary 1 Students at St. Francis of Assisi's English Primary School]. Hong Kong Economic Times (in Chinese). Archived from the original on 2024-12-30. Retrieved 2024-12-30.

      The article notes: "位於深水埗區的聖方濟各英文小學在1955年創校，學校重視學生的語文能力，除兩文三語外，更讓學生接觸其他外語，提升競爭力。學校現正招收2022-2023學年小一新生，截止報名日期為9月13日。"

      From Google Translate: "St. Francis of Assisi English Primary School in Sham Shui Po District was founded in 1955. The school attaches great importance to students' language skills. In addition to being biliterate and trilingual, it also exposes students to other foreign languages to enhance their competitiveness. The school is now recruiting new primary school students for the 2022-2023 school year, and the deadline for registration is 13 September."

    8. Articles about the church and school from Ayako Fukushima:
      1. Fukushima, Ayako (2020-02-21). "The last Chinese style architecture: St. Francis of Assisi Church and School in Shek Kip Mei". Sunday Examiner. Archived from the original on 2024-12-30. Retrieved 2024-12-30.

        The article notes: "St. Francis of Assisi Church and School was built in Shek Kip Mei in 1955 in the Chinese renaissance architectural style (or adaptive Chinese style), which refers to buildings using modern materials such as reinforced concrete with designs of traditional Chinese architecture such as a curving upturned roof with tiles and imitated bracket system. ... After the late 1950s, architecture of Hong Kong lost style and became mostly functional. As a historian, I tried to uncover forgotten stories of St. Francis of Assisi Church and wish to share some of them below. Further details can be found in my journal article, Building St. Francis of Assisi Church and School in Hong Kong: Emergence of Church and School Complex in the 1950s, in Architectural Institute of Japan Journal of Architectural Planning, Vol. 85, No. 768, published in February 2020."

      2. Fukushima, Ayako (February 2020). "Building St. Francis of Assisi Church and School in Hong Kong: Emergence of Church and School Complex" (PDF). Journal of Architectural Planning. 85 (768). Architectural Institute of Japan: 453–462. doi:10.3130/aija.85.453. Retrieved 2024-12-30.
    9. Less significant coverage:
      1. "巴域街考古 賞半世紀中西合璧教堂" [Archaeology on Bay Street: A Half-Century of Chinese-Western Fusion in Churches]. Ming Pao (in Chinese). 2022-07-29. Archived from the original on 2024-12-30. Retrieved 2024-12-30.

        The article notes: "路程大致從聖方濟各英文小學旁出發，漫步至美荷樓完結。先參觀位於聖方濟各英文小學旁的聖方濟各堂，「香港探古」版主Nicky介紹，它暫時未獲古物譫詢委員會評級，但早於1956年建成，屬於中華文藝復興建築風格的香港天主教教堂，既展現圓拱美學，亦有橙紅色中式瓦頂，中西合璧的風格加上保存良好，值得一看。"

        From Google Translate: "The journey roughly starts next to St. Francis English Primary School and ends at Mei Ho House. First visit the St. Francis Church located next to St. Francis English Primary School. Nicky, the moderator of "Hong Kong Exploration" introduced that it has not yet been rated by the Antiquities Advisory Board, but it was built as early as 1956 and belongs to the Chinese Renaissance architectural style. The Hong Kong Catholic Church not only displays the aesthetics of round arches, but also has an orange-red Chinese-style tile roof. It combines Chinese and Western styles and is well preserved. It is worth a visit."

      2. "聖方濟各堂 融入社區助草根" [St. Francis Church Integrates into the Community to Support Grassroots]. Hong Kong Economic Times (in Chinese). 2016-06-09. Archived from the original on 2024-12-30. Retrieved 2024-12-30.

        The article notes: "天主教紮根香港174年，一直由開設教堂、辦學和推行社會服務3大環節組成，其中深水埗聖方濟各堂（St. Francis of Assisi Church）堪稱融入社區的佼佼者。"

        From Google Translate: "Catholicism has taken root in Hong Kong for 174 years and has always been composed of three major links: opening churches, running schools, and implementing social services. Among them, St. Francis of Assisi Church in Sham Shui Po is a leader in integrating into the community."

        The article notes; "本地現有256間天主教學校，夏其龍指聖方濟各英文小學赫赫有名，多少因為50至70年代間，幫助區內貧苦大眾考入鮮少能讀到的英文中學，避免失卻入大學機會。 「以前社會你若讀書好，一定會做到（階級上流）。」"

        From Google Translate: "There are 256 Catholic schools in the local area. Xia Qilong pointed out that St. Francis of Assisi English Primary School is very famous, partly because from the 1950s to the 1970s, it helped poor people in the area get into English secondary schools that were rarely available and avoid losing the opportunity to enter university. "In the past society, if you were good at studying, you would definitely achieve (high class status).""

    There is sufficient coverage in reliable sources to allow St. Francis of Assisi's English Primary School (traditional Chinese: 聖方濟各英文小學; simplified Chinese: 圣方济各英文小学) to pass Wikipedia:Notability#General notability guideline, which requires "significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject".

    Cunard (talk) 05:55, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Cunard Thank you for finding these sources. I'm curious how you're accessing the Hong Kong newspapers? Helpful Raccoon (talk) 06:18, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Some of these sources are from databases that index Hong Kong newspapers. Cunard (talk) 06:20, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Mavis Ma

Mavis Ma (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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This article seems to be written in a highly NPOV style, it almost reads like a political attack ad. I'm also not so sure this person even meets GNG and should not be considered notable through their brother(Although it is possible that I'm missing articles not in English). GoldMiner24 Talk 04:52, 27 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  • Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Politicians, Women, China, Hong Kong, Taiwan, Massachusetts, and New York. WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 05:21, 27 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep: I agree with the nom that the article currently documents too many "controversies" which potentially violates NPOV. Some minor incidents, such as the subject being scolded by her father in public or her endorsements of candidates, are totally UNDUE and can certainly be removed. However, I believe most content can stay, as much of the subject's political career involved dirty work, supported by numerous sources and opinion pieces like the one from Apple Daily by Neil Peng (source 33). Although NPOV is a serious concern, AFD is not cleanup, and I do not think notability is an issue for the subject. Currently, there are more than 30 sources listed in the article, with even more in the zhwiki one. I scanned through the first 10 sources, and sources 2, 4, 5, 6, 9, and 10 all provided SIGCOV on the subject and are certainly enough to pass GNG. Not to mention a simple Google News search can already yield many full articles about the subject, such as these articles from Central News Agency[4] and ETtoday[5]. I also think that her case regarding the violation of conflict of interest should be sufficient to meet WP:PERP. —Prince of Erebor（The Book of Mazarbul） 06:22, 27 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep per the significant coverage in multiple independent reliable sources. The subject passes Wikipedia:Notability (people)#Basic criteria, which says:

    People are presumed notable if they have received significant coverage in multiple published secondary sources that are reliable, intellectually independent of each other, and independent of the subject.

    • If the depth of coverage in any given source is not substantial, then multiple independent sources may be combined to demonstrate notability; trivial coverage of a subject by secondary sources is not usually sufficient to establish notability.

    Sources

    1. The sources listed by Prince of Erebor (talk · contribs) and those already in the article.
    2. Li, Hsin-i 李心怡 (2008-02-20). "馬以南作風大膽 拆掉馬英九包裝" [[Ma Yinan's Bold Style: Unveiling the True Image of Ma Ying-jeou]. New Taiwan Weekly [zh] (in Chinese). No. 622. Archived from the original on 2024-12-30. Retrieved 2024-12-30.

      The article notes: "原來，馬以南一九六二年考上台大外文系之後曾轉到植病學系，因此延畢一年；原來，馬以南在一九六六年曾替一考生代考大學聯考擔任「槍手」；原來，「槍手案」爆發後，檢方以陳姓考生未考取大學為由，未起訴馬以南，連罪證確鑿的偽造文書罪都沒有，也沒有被台大退學；原來，馬以南在案子起訴前已早一步前往美國求學、申請綠卡、當美國公民；原來，中央日報刊登所有涉案人詳細資料時，可以獨漏馬以南的犯罪事實、代價金額與知情家長姓名等資料；原來，馬英九一家享盡特權，媒體、司法遇到他們都沒轍；原來，所謂家教甚嚴的家庭，竟是教出說謊、詐欺、涉嫌貪污的子女。"

      From Google Translate: "It turns out that Ma Yin-nan, after being admitted to the Department of Foreign Languages at National Taiwan University in 1962, later transferred to the Department of Plant Pathology, which caused him to delay his graduation by one year. It turns out that in 1966, Ma Yin-nan acted as a "gunman" (substitute test-taker) for a student during the university entrance exams. It turns out that after the "gunman case" broke, the prosecutor did not indict Ma Yin-nan, citing that the student (Chen) did not get into a university, and even though there was solid evidence of forgery, he was not charged with falsifying documents, nor was he expelled from National Taiwan University. It turns out that before the case was prosecuted, Ma Yin-nan had already gone to the United States to study, applied for a green card, and became a U.S. citizen. It turns out that when the Central Daily News published detailed information about all those involved in the case, they conveniently omitted Ma Yin-nan's criminal facts, the amount of money involved, and the names of the parents who were aware of the situation. It turns out that the Ma Ying-jeou family enjoyed special privileges, with the media and the judiciary unable to do anything in the face of their influence. It turns out that the so-called "strict family upbringing" actually produced children who lied, committed fraud, and were suspected of corruption."

    3. Peng, Neil (2013-10-25). "【馮光遠專欄】馬英九的門神" [【Feng Kuan-yuan's Column】Ma Ying-jeou's Gatekeeper]]. Apple Daily (in Chinese). Archived from the original on 2015-09-24. Retrieved 2024-12-30.

      The article notes: "馬以南之所以又冒出來，因為她這個門神，事業做得還真大，除了增進身體健康的一堆藥廠請她守門，戕害身體健康的假油業者也找上她，可見外戚在今日台灣是同時受到健康跟不健康企業的愛戴。"

      From Google Translate: "The reason why Ma Yinan appears again is because she is a doorkeeper and has a really big career. In addition to a lot of pharmaceutical companies that improve health, she is hired to guard the door. She is also approached by fake oil companies that harm health. It can be seen that her relatives are in Today, Taiwan is loved by both healthy and unhealthy companies."

    4. Tsai, Ching-hsuan 蔡靚萱 (2010-02-03). "超完美箭靶 馬以南" [An Almost Perfect Target: Mavis Ma]. Yam [zh] (in Chinese). Archived from the original on 2014-12-21. Retrieved 2024-12-30.

      The article notes: "事實上，自從馬英九於二○○八年當選總統以後，過去在助選場合、黨務、生技製藥界相當活躍的馬以南，幾乎是被迫自縛雙手、低調過日子。不但辭去民間公司職務，曾高票當選國民黨中央委員的她，在國民黨擬定○九年中央委員候選名單時，因馬英九特別請黨主席吳伯雄「不要把我大姊放進去」，宣告正式退出黨務。"

      From Google Translate: "In fact, since Ma Ying-jeou was elected president in 2008, Ma Yinan, who used to be very active in campaign events, party affairs, and the biotech and pharmaceutical industry, has been almost forced to tie his hands and live a low-key life. Not only did she resign from a private company, but she was once elected as a member of the KMT Central Committee with a high vote. When the KMT was drawing up the candidate list for the 2009 Central Committee, Ma Ying-jeou specifically asked party chairman Wu Boxiong to "don't include my eldest sister in the list." She announced her official withdrawal from the party."

    There is sufficient coverage in reliable sources to allow Mavis Ma (traditional Chinese: 馬以南; simplified Chinese: 马以南) to pass Wikipedia:Notability#General notability guideline, which requires "significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject".

    Cunard (talk) 11:37, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Tunbow

Tunbow (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

Appears to be wholly promotional Amigao (talk) 06:10, 23 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  • Keep per the significant coverage in multiple independent reliable sources.
    1. Chong, Cheng-man 莊程敏; Yan, Kiu-ling 殷考玲 (2021-09-09). "老品牌拓疆土 升級須創新" [Old Brands Expand Territories, Upgrading Requires Innovation]. Lion Rock Daily [zh] (in Chinese). p. P6. Archived from the original on 2024-12-29. Retrieved 2024-12-29.

      The article notes: "有「熨斗大王」之稱的東保集團創辦人兼主席陳鑑光博士，憑藉2001年推出自家研發塑料製成的電子控溫熨斗，短短一年售出逾70萬件，從此奠定集團在歐洲市場的地位，但他並未因此滿足。去年在港設立研究開發部門，為進軍大灣區9市市場作準備，目標以開拓9+2城市的家庭為主。東保集團成立逾25年，產品走中高端路線，研究開發（R&D）部門一直在內地，但由去年起在香港同樣設立R&D部門並設逾20位開發人員"

      From Google Translate: "Dr. Chen Jianguang, the founder and chairman of Tunbow Group, known as the "Iron King", launched his own electronic temperature-controlled irons made of plastic in 2001. More than 700,000 units were sold in just one year, establishing the group's position in the European market. status, but he was not satisfied with it. Last year, a research and development department was established in Hong Kong to prepare for entering the 9 cities in the Greater Bay Area. The goal is to develop families in the 9+2 cities. Tunbow Group has been established for more than 25 years, and its products are mid-to-high-end. The research and development (R&D) department has always been in the mainland. But since last year, it has also set up an R&D department in Hong Kong with more than 20 developers."

    2. "鼓勵溝通合作 助企業擺脫單打獨鬥 香港模具及產品科技協會 見證「百業之母」改朝換代" [Encouraging Communication and Cooperation to Help Businesses Break Free from Solo Struggles: Hong Kong Mould and Product Technology Association Witnesses the Transformation of the 'Mother of All Industries']. Headline Daily (in Chinese). 2016-01-28. p. P40.

      The article notes: "憑首創開放蒸發器熨斗，成功晉身世界五大熨斗代工生產商，贏得“熨斗大王”稱譽的東保集團創辦人兼主席陳鑑光博士（Dr. Charles Chan，見圖），全靠他面對挑戰時視危為機的信念。陳鑑光博士與他的太太在90年代初期決定闖一闖，合組貿易公司，成立東保。在創業初期，東保只是以設計及貿易性質運作。"

      From Google Translate: "With the first open evaporator iron, Dr. Charles Chan (pictured), founder and chairman of Tunbow Group, successfully joined the world's top five iron OEM manufacturers and won the title of "Iron King", all because of his ability to face challenges The belief that every crisis is an opportunity. Dr. Chen Kam-kwong and his wife decided to venture into the business in the early 1990s, forming a trading company and establishing Tunbow. In the early days of business, Tunbow only operated in the nature of design and trading."

    3. Sit, Wai-kit 薛偉傑 (2010-08-06). "小家電商 8招抗逆境" [8 Strategies for Small Home Appliance Businesses to Overcome Adversity]. Ming Pao (in Chinese). p. B11.

      The article notes: "東保集團成立於1995 年，主力生產小型家電，特別是電熨斗。其客戶包括多個知名品牌如伊萊克斯、飛利浦、白朗、Kenwood、勝家等。"

      From Google Translate: "Tunbow Group was established in 1995 and focuses on the production of small household appliances, especially electric irons. Its customers include many well-known brands such as Electrolux, Philips, Blanc, Kenwood, Singer, etc."

      The article notes: "另外，東保集團與一般廠商不同的， 是它很強調一條龍式垂直生產。該公司自設電路板生產部、五金部、壓鑄部、塑膠部、噴油部等。總之，就是自行生產其小家電所需的電路板、金屬機殼、塑膠機殼，以及自行為機殼噴油。"

      From Google Translate: "In addition, Tunbow Group is different from ordinary manufacturers in that it emphasises one-stop vertical production. The company has its own circuit board production department, hardware department, die-casting department, plastic department, fuel injection department, etc. In short, it means producing the circuit boards, metal casings, and plastic casings needed for its small household appliances by itself, and spraying oil on the casings by itself."

    4. Leung Man-fung 梁文峰 (2010-07-12). "東保拓內銷 或5年內上市" [Tunbow Expands Domestic Sales, May Go Public within 5 Years]. Sing Pao Daily News (in Chinese). p. B1.

      The article notes: "家電設計、生產商東保集團為開拓內銷市場，正於惠州投資5億元擴展生產基地，預計總產能將提升5 倍。現時深圳兩廠房共有約20條生產線，年產800萬台小家電。"

      From Google Translate: "Tunbow Group, a home appliance designer and manufacturer, is investing 500 million yuan to expand its production base in Huizhou in order to develop the domestic market. It is expected that the total production capacity will increase five times. Currently, the two factories in Shenzhen have a total of about 20 production lines, with an annual output of 8 million units of small household appliances."

    5. "圖：深圳港資企業「綠色風」盛" [Tunbow Expands Domestic Sales, May Go Public Within 5 Years] (in Chinese). China News Service. 2010-07-07.

      The article notes: "7月7日，一群香港媒體記者專程來到深圳寶安，釆訪推行「綠色生產」、「綠色小家電」揚名業界的香港東保集團深圳生產基地。該集團為減少生產污染投資3,000多萬港圓對硬體和軟體進行改善工程，企業環保創新產品不斷出現。目前集團20條生產線，年產800萬台各式家用電器，暢銷美國、加拿大及歐盟、東南亞26個國家。"

      From Google Translate: "On 7 July a group of Hong Kong media reporters made a special trip to Bao'an, Shenzhen to visit the Shenzhen production base of Hong Kong Tunbow Group, which is famous in the industry for promoting "green production" and "green small home appliances". The group has invested more than HKD 30 million in hardware and software improvement projects to reduce production pollution, and innovative environmentally friendly products have continued to emerge. At present, the group has 20 production lines, with an annual output of 8 million units of various household appliances, which are sold well in the United States, Canada, the European Union, and 26 countries in Southeast Asia."

    6. "東保集團董事總經理 鄧美華 東保集團積極開拓高技術高加值特色化的家電產品" [Tunbow Group Managing Director, Ms. Tan Meihua: Tunbow Group Actively Expanding High-Tech, High-Value, and Specialised Home Appliance Products]. Hong Kong Commercial Daily (in Chinese). 2018-12-19. p. AA10.

      The article notes: "身為本港知名企業，東保集團積極開拓高技術、高增值、特色化的家電產品，推出電子熨斗、強力蒸氣專業熨斗、電子蒸籠、濃湯機及全自動咖啡機。公司成立於1994年，與香港一同經歷風雨，亦一同成長。作為營商者為公司賺取利潤固然重要，但東保集團更有一份香港精神，與客戶共渡時艱，這更為可貴。"

      From Google Translate: "As a well-known enterprise in Hong Kong, Tunbow Group actively develops high-tech, high value-added and specialised home appliance products, launching electronic irons, powerful steam professional irons, electronic steamers, soup makers and fully automatic coffee machines. The company was established in 1994 and has experienced ups and downs together with Hong Kong and has grown together. As a businessman, it is important to make profits for the company, but Tunbow Group has more of a Hong Kong spirit and shares difficulties with its customers, which is even more valuable."

    There is sufficient coverage in reliable sources to allow Tunbow Group (traditional Chinese: 東保集團; simplified Chinese: 东保集团) to pass Wikipedia:Notability (organizations and companies)#Primary criteria, which requires "significant coverage in multiple reliable secondary sources that are independent of the subject".

    Cunard (talk) 09:36, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: An additional review of new sources would be useful.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 07:15, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Lantau Link Visitors Centre (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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Even after addition of sources, topic still seems unimportant. Revirvlkodlaku (talk) 13:35, 20 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  • Merge and Redirect to Tsing_Ma_Bridge#Tourism - I don't think the sources constitute significant coverage, Source 1 and 4 are basically the same article from the same source, Source 5 is barely in-depth and just those two sources don't reach the level required; this article will never be able to expanded upon based on the available sources. I think merging into Tsing_Ma_Bridge#Tourism would be better. :JeffUK 14:01, 20 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Merge with Tsing_Ma_Bridge#Tourism: "Seems unimportant" is not a reason for deletion, but everything I found (with the help of Google translate) ties it into the bridge. Length isn't an issue, so I think a merger makes the most sense here. Star Mississippi 14:10, 20 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    • @JeffUK and Star Mississippi: I am interested to hear more detailed comments on the sources from you guys. Even if articles from the same media outlet count as one like Jeff suggested, the Oriental Daily News articles are a still decent source that detail the development and current condition of the visitor centre's lack of maintenance. The am730 article is barely in-depth? The 1,800-word article is entirely about the centre, ranging from its construction history, to its tourism development, and to the recent public discussions about revitalization. I would really like to hear what Jeff thinks this article is about if you believe it is not focused on the visitor centre, and how does it relate to the bridge when it was only briefly mentioned for four times throughout the article? GNG only requires SIGCOV from multiple sources, and these two articles already meet the criterion, not to mention other sources currently listed in the article, like the Sing Tao Daily article (source 9) which is also entirely about the centre and viewing platform. I think a potential factor leading to our varied analyses of the sources may stem from the disregard for the mentions of the viewing platform in those articles. The official name of the location is actually Lantau Link Visitors Centre and Viewing Platform[6][7] (like the Chinese translation suggested: 青嶼幹綫訪客中心及觀景台), and they are the same place. (I believe a move is much needed if this article is to be kept.). —Prince of Erebor（The Book of Mazarbul） 14:32, 20 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
      As WP:GNG says "This is not a guarantee that a topic will necessarily be handled as a separate, stand-alone page." I think it will look great as a part of the Tsing Ma Bridge article. On the specific source, barely means 'it is in-depth, but only just', the fact it's 1,800 words long isn't relevant, it's a lot of talk that says very little, the reason we have WP:SIGCOV is, partly, to ensure there is enough unique information available for us to create an article. JeffUK 15:17, 20 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
      I agree with @JeffUK here @Prince of Erebor. The reader wants to learn about the bridge, which includes this viewing area. They are the same subject and it makes sense for them to be covered together. WP:NOPAGE is also helpful here. It would be different if there was information independent of the bridge and/or there was a length issue. I think the official name isn't a strong issue, it can be addressed with a redirect should this close as merge or be retained as a standalone. Star Mississippi 15:28, 20 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
      [Edit conflict] JeffUK, I apologize if my emphasis on the article's length caused confusion. I understand that your initial comment was about the article lacking SIGCOV on the subject, which I respectfully disagreed with, as the article is entirely focused on it. I do not believe your interpretation of SIGCOV aligns with what SIGCOV means. SIGCOV refers to a source that addresses the topic directly and in detail, rather than providing only a passing or brief mention, so I do not think the am730 article fails to meet SIGCOV. I think you are more likely referring to WP:NOPAGE, and I understand your perspective and the rationale that notability alone does not guarantee a standalone article. If the current article were a stub with only two sentences and only two sources just to bypass GNG, I definitely agree with you. But the article has sufficient notability, especially with a revitalization project underway and ongoing news coverage, including articles published as recently as this year (the Our China Story source). Therefore, I do not agree with your assertion that the article has no potential for expansion, and I do not see a need to merge it. —Prince of Erebor（The Book of Mazarbul） 15:44, 20 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
      Sorry, Star Mississippi, we were writing at the same time, and my comment was only addressing Jeff's arguments. However, I also thought you guys were leaning towards the NOPAGE side, and imo, the revitalization project mentioned in the am730 source already indicates the subject's independence from the bridge. I realize I may have failed to express my final comments regarding the official name of the Centre. What I meant to convey is that the viewing platform is also part of the subject, so perhaps you guys overlooked the lines discussing the viewing platform or observation deck and thought they referred to the bridge instead of the Centre, because I was a bit confused when multiple editors found that article lacked in-depth coverage of the subject. Apologies for the confusion. —Prince of Erebor（The Book of Mazarbul） 15:54, 20 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
      Anyway, thanks both for clarifying things for me and I now understand the arguments from you guys, which focus not on the sources but on the lack of independence of the subject. Let's see what other editors have to say about this. —Prince of Erebor（The Book of Mazarbul） 16:11, 20 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
      All good @Prince of Erebor and we'll see where this lands. I'm not against retention, I'm just not sure it's the best solution for readers. Thanks, as always, for your detailed input. Star Mississippi 19:15, 20 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep per the significant coverage in multiple independent reliable sources.
    Wikipedia:Notability#Whether to create standalone pages

    Wikipedia:Notability#Whether to create standalone pages says:

    When creating new content about a notable topic, editors should consider how best to help readers understand it. Often, understanding is best achieved by presenting the topic on a dedicated standalone page, but it is not required that we do so; at times it is better to cover a notable topic as part of a larger page about a broader topic, with more context (and doing so in no way disparages the importance of the topic).

    The guideline says to consider three questions:
    1. Does other information provide needed context? Sometimes, a notable topic can be covered better as part of a larger article, where there can be more complete context that would be lost on a separate page" – I do not think context would be lost by covering Lantau Link Visitors Centre on its own page.
    2. Do related topics provide needed context? Sometimes, several related topics, each of them similarly notable, can be collected into a single page, where the relationships between them can be better appreciated than if they were each a separate page – I think that a brief mention of Lantau Link Visitors Centre in Tsing Ma Bridge#Tourism is sufficient and that merging the entire article about the centre to there would not allow relationships to be "better appreciated than if they were each a separate page".
    3. What sourcing is available now? Sometimes, when a subject is notable, but it is unlikely that there ever will be a lot to write about it, editors should weigh the advantages and disadvantages of creating a permanent stub. – there is a lot to write about. This article is already much larger than a "permanent stub". It could be further expanded with the additional sources I've presented here.
    There are multiple possible merge targets:
    1. Tsing Yi island – this bridge is on the island
    2. Tsing Ma Bridge#Tourism – sources mention that this bridge can be seen from the centre
    3. Kap Shui Mun Bridge – sources mention that this bridge can be seen from the centre
    4. Ting Kau Bridge – sources mention that this bridge can be seen from the centre

    When there are this many merge targets, I'm inclined to support a standalone article. A merge to any of those pages would result in undue weight. The sources discuss the centre's history, the various government entities that managed it over the years, why it became in disrepair and the plans to fix it, the three bridges that can be seen from it, the contents of the centre ("the information models, photos, and interactive games about the bridges"), and the flowers around it ("It is the place with the largest number of Rhododendrons planted in a single location in Hong Kong"). There is sufficient content and sources to support a standalone article about the centre.

    Sources
    1. "am專訪｜青嶼幹線觀景台活化正收集建議　葵青DO鄧顯權：公眾參與最重要　冀善用潛力搞旺設施" [am Exclusive Interview｜Suggestions are being collected for the revitalization of the Lantau Link Observation Deck. Kwai Tsing DO Tang Hin-kuen: Public participation is the most important and we hope to make good use of the potential to develop facilities.]. am730 (in Chinese). 2023-11-24. Archived from the original on 2024-12-23. Retrieved 2024-12-23.
      The article notes: "坐落青衣島西北角落的青嶼幹線觀景台及訪客中心，坐擁青馬大橋和汀九橋的海景，與青馬大橋一同在1997年啟用，初時吸引大批市民到訪一覽新橋景色，惟熱潮過後人流不再，公共交通服務在緊接數年亦縮減至每小時一班專線小巴。在疫情前的2019年，觀景台有約11.6萬人次到訪，而今年截至上月31日訪客人次已達53,280人，約為疫前的一半。為吸引更多遊客，葵青民政事務處今年8月推出「青嶼想想」計劃，就活化觀景台收集市民意見，包括在區內擺街站、舉辦工作坊和邀請遞交建議書等。"
      From Google Translate: "The Lantau Link Observation Deck and Visitor Centre, located at the northwest corner of Tsing Yi Island, has a sea view of the Tsing Ma Bridge and Ting Kau Bridge. It was opened in 1997 together with the Tsing Ma Bridge. It initially attracted a large number of citizens to visit and enjoy the scenery of the new bridge. However, After the boom, the flow of people stopped, and public transport services were reduced to one green minibus every hour in the following years. In 2019 before the pandemic, about 116,000 people visited the observation deck. As of last month 31 this year, the number of visitors had reached 53,280, about half of the number before the pandemic. In order to attract more tourists, the Kwai Tsing District Office launched the "Think About Lantau" project in August this year to collect public opinions on the revitalization of the observation deck, including setting up street stops in the district, holding workshops and inviting submissions of proposals."
    2. Lung, Ngai-cheung 龍藝祥 (2012-12-09). "青嶼幹線觀景台拍照一流" [The Lantau Link Observation Deck is great for taking photos]. Sing Pao Daily News (in Chinese). p. A6.
      The article notes: "青嶼幹線訪客中心及觀景台位於青衣島西北角，是香港一所介紹青嶼幹線的展覽館，佔地19,000平方米，訪客中心是於1997年5月隨青嶼幹線通車正式對外開放，觀景台設有青馬大橋、汲水門大橋、汀九橋組件戶外展覽及訪客中心。訪客中心設有介紹大橋資料模型、相片和互動遊戲；從螺旋式的小路繞著圓柱形的觀景台而上，遊人便可以較近距離或高角度，可遠眺青馬大橋、汲水門大橋及汀九橋，訪客中心設有行人天橋連接停車場，公廁設在停車場。"
      From Google Translate: "The Lantau Link Visitor Centre and Observation Deck is located in the northwest corner of Tsing Yi Island. It is an exhibition hall introducing the Lantau Link in Hong Kong, covering an area of 19,000 square meters. The visitor centre was officially opened to the public in May 1997 with the opening of the Lantau Link. The observation deck has an outdoor exhibition and visitor centre for the Tsing Ma Bridge, Kap Shui Mun Bridge and Ting Kau Bridge components. The visitor centre is equipped with information models, photos and interactive games about the bridges. Going up the spiral path around the cylindrical observation deck, visitors can overlook the Tsing Ma Bridge and Kap Shui Mun Bridge from a close or high angle. and Ting Kau Bridge, the visitor centre has a pedestrian bridge connecting the parking lot, and public toilets are located in the parking lot."
      The article notes: "訪客中心最初由新機場工程總署負責管理及運作，該署於1998年解散後，展覽中心交由民政事務總署葵青民政事務處負責管理。此外，訪客中心種植大量洋紫荊、羊蹄甲屬、杜鵑花等植物，是香港單一地點種植最多杜鵑花的地方。"
      From Google Translate: "The Visitor Centre was initially managed and operated by the New Airport Works Department. After the Department was disbanded in 1998, the exhibition centre was managed by the Kwai Tsing District Office of the Home Affairs Department. In addition, the Visitor Centre is planted with a large number of Bauhinia spp., Rhododendron spp., Rhododendron and other plants. It is the place with the largest number of Rhododendrons planted in a single location in Hong Kong."
    3. "山水兼備風景優美 回歸紀念徑 青衣頭等風光" [A Blend of Mountains and Water, Beautiful Scenery: Top Views at the Return of Sovereignty Commemoration Trail, Tsing Yi]. Hong Kong Daily News [zh] (in Chinese). 2014-12-19. pp. Q16 – Q17.
      The article notes: "若大家想一覽可青馬大橋、汲水門大橋及汀九橋，青嶼幹線訪客中心及觀景台是值得一去的地方，它位於青衣島西北角，是一所介紹青嶼幹線的展覽館，佔地19000平方米，於1997年5月隨青嶼幹線通車正式對外開放。"
      From Google Translate: "If you want to take a look at the Tsing Ma Bridge, Kap Shui Mun Bridge and Ting Kau Bridge, the Lantau Link Visitor Centre and Observation Deck is a place worth visiting. It is located in the northwest corner of Tsing Yi Island and is an exhibition hall introducing the Lantau Link, covering an area of 19,000 square meters, was officially opened to the public in May 1997 with the opening of the Lantau Main Line."
      The article notes: "觀景台設有青馬大橋、汲水門大橋、汀九橋組件戶外展覽及訪客中心。訪客中心設有介紹大橋資料模型、相片和互動遊戲；從螺旋式的小路繞著圓柱形的觀景台而上，遊人便可以近距離或高角度眺望青馬大橋、汲水門大橋及汀九橋，訪客中心設有行人天橋連接停車場，公廁設在停車場。青嶼幹線訪客中心及觀景台訪客中心及觀景台免費入場。"
      From Google Translate: "The observation deck has an outdoor exhibition and visitor centre for the Tsing Ma Bridge, Kap Shui Mun Bridge and Ting Kau Bridge components. The visitor centre is equipped with information models, photos and interactive games on the bridge. Going up the spiral path around the cylindrical observation deck, visitors can view the Tsing Ma Bridge, Kap Shui Mun Bridge and Ting Kau Bridge at close range or from a high angle. , the visitor centre has a pedestrian bridge connecting the parking lot, and public toilets are located in the parking lot. Lantau Link Visitor Centre and Observation Deck Admission to the Visitor Centre and Observation Deck is free."
      The article notes: "此外，訪客中心種植大量洋紫荊、羊蹄甲屬、杜鵑花等植物，是香港單一地點種植最多杜鵑花的地方。每年二、三月期間，萬朵杜鵑花盛開的時候，到來賞花也是一樂也。另外亦種有一棵逾百年的細葉榕。"
      From Google Translate: "In addition, the Visitor Centre is planted with a large number of Bauhinia spp., Rhododendron spp., Rhododendron and other plants. It is the place with the largest number of Rhododendrons planted in a single location in Hong Kong. Every year during February and March, when thousands of azaleas are in full bloom, it is a pleasure to come and enjoy the flowers. There is also a fig tree that is over a hundred years old."
    4. "青嶼幹線觀景台欄杆日久失修　破爛穿窿訪客靠近有危險" [Railings of Lantau Link Observation Deck Deteriorated Over Time, With Holes and Damage Posing Danger to Visitors]. Oriental Daily News (in Chinese). 2021-01-17. Archived from the original on 2024-12-23. Retrieved 2024-12-23.
      The article notes: "青嶼幹線觀景台屬本港重要地標之一，訪客可看到青馬大橋、汀九橋以及馬灣海峽，惟當局未有妥善管理，令觀景台日久失修，危機處處。本報接獲讀者投訴，指觀景台欄杆驚現大量裂紋，更有部分欄杆表面破爛，原本空心的內部積藏垃圾。有區議員直言擔心有潛在危險，促當局盡快處理；有測量師則指，當局應趁現在進行一個較完整的維修。當局回覆本報查詢時表示，正安排維修欄杆。"
      From Google Translate: "The Lantau Link Observation Deck is one of the important landmarks in Hong Kong. Visitors can see the Tsing Ma Bridge, Ting Kau Bridge and Ma Wan Strait. However, the authorities have not properly managed it, causing the observation deck to be in disrepair over time and full of dangers. This newspaper received complaints from readers that a large number of cracks appeared on the railings of the observation deck, and some of the railings were tattered, with garbage accumulating inside the originally hollow interior. Some district councilors bluntly expressed concerns about potential dangers and urged the authorities to deal with it as soon as possible; some surveyors pointed out that the authorities should take advantage of the opportunity to carry out a more complete repair. In response to this newspaper's inquiry, the authorities stated that they were arranging repairs to the railings."
    5. Cheng, Yuk-kwan 鄭玉君 (2020-04-07). Siu, Ching-man 肖靜文 (ed.). "賞橋又賞花" [Enjoy the Bridge and Flowers]. Hong Kong Commercial Daily (in Chinese). Archived from the original on 2024-12-23. Retrieved 2024-12-23.
      The article notes: "位處青衣島鑊底灣西北面的青嶼幹線訪客中心及觀景台，週末便有數百人前來觀賞。若想人少一點，最好在平日的早上。在晴朗天氣登上觀景台，景色一絕，宏偉的青馬大橋及汀九橋就在眼前，亦可遠眺馬灣一帶景色，3 月時節，洋紫荊及杜鵑花還未凋謝，賞橋又賞花，襯上藍天白雲，可謂良辰美景。"
      From Google Translate: "The Lantau Link Visitor Centre and Observation Deck, located northwest of Wok Di Wan on Tsing Yi Island, attracts hundreds of people to watch it on weekends. If you want fewer people, it’s best to go in the morning on a weekday. On a clear day, you can go up to the observation deck for a stunning view. The majestic Tsing Ma Bridge and Ting Kau Bridge are right in front of you. You can also overlook the scenery of Ma Wan in the distance. In March, the redbuds and azaleas are not yet withered, so you can enjoy the bridge viewing. And admiring the flowers, against the blue sky and white clouds, it is a beautiful scene on a good day."
      The article notes: "訪客中心於1997 年8 月啟用，20 多年來成為外地旅客了解機場核心計畫工程之一的青嶼幹線港的橋頭堡，觀景台也展出青馬大橋和汀九橋的組件。在青衣機鐵站專線小巴站搭乘308M 線可到達訪客中心。"
      From Google Translate: "The Visitor Centre was opened in August 1997. Over the past 20 years, it has been a bridgehead for foreign tourists to learn about the Lantau Link Port, one of the core projects of the airport. The observation deck also displays components of the Tsing Ma Bridge and Ting Kau Bridge. Take the 308M route from the Tsing Yi Airport Green Minibus Station to the Visitor Centre."
    6. "每年多近13萬人到訪青嶼幹線觀景台　欄杆破爛危險亦影響觀感" [Nearly 130,000 people visit the Lantau Link Observation Deck every year. The broken and dangerous railings also affect the viewing experience.]. Oriental Daily News (in Chinese). 2021-01-17. Archived from the original on 2024-12-23. Retrieved 2024-12-23.
      The article notes:" 不少旅遊團均會到訪青嶼幹線觀景台，是1997年隨着青嶼幹線通車正式對外開放，佔地約1.9萬平方米，除可看到青馬大橋及汀九橋，因每年春天杜鵑花盛開，亦是拍照打卡的好地方。據葵青民政事務處數字，在2017至2020年，每年到訪人次介乎8.3萬至13.3萬。當區區議員表示，欄杆破爛不但影響遊人觀感，更擔心有潛在危險，促當局盡快處理。"
      From Google Translate: "Many tourist groups will visit the Lantau Link Observation Deck. It was officially opened to the public in 1997 with the opening of the Lantau Link. It covers an area of about 19,000 square meters. In addition to Tsing Ma Bridge and Ting Kau Bridge, it can be seen every year. Rhododendrons are in full bloom in spring, making it a great place to take photos. According to figures from the Kwai Tsing District Office, from 2017 to 2020, the number of visitors per year ranged from 83,000 to 133,000. The district councilors said that the broken railings not only affected the perception of tourists, but also worried about potential dangers, and urged the authorities to deal with it as soon as possible."
    7. Ling, Wai 凌薇 (2008-09-20). "世上最長行車鐵路雙用懸索吊橋/青馬大橋" [Tsing Ma Bridge, the longest dual-purpose suspension bridge for railways in the world]. Ta Kung Pao (in Chinese). Archived from the original on 2024-12-23. Retrieved 2024-12-23.
      The article notes: "青馬大橋是香港道路重要的一部分，它聯同汲水門大橋，共同擔當連接大嶼山、赤鱲角香港國際機場與市區的唯一行車通道。同時也成為香港的重要地標和景點，吸引了世界各地的遊客前往參觀。因此，政府在青衣西北部設立青嶼幹線訪客中心及觀景台，讓遊人可以較近距離或高角度遠眺青馬大橋、汲水門大橋及汀九橋。訪客中心及觀景台於1997年隨青嶼幹線通車對外開放。"
      From Google Translate: "The Tsing Ma Bridge is an important part of Hong Kong's roads. Together with the Kap Shui Mun Bridge, it serves as the only driving channel connecting Lantau Island, the Hong Kong International Airport in Chek Lap Kok and the urban area. At the same time, it has become an important landmark and attraction in Hong Kong, attracting tourists from all over the world. Therefore, the government has set up a Lantau Link Visitor Centre and Observation Deck in the northwest of Tsing Yi, allowing visitors to view the Tsing Ma Bridge, Kap Shui Mun Bridge and Ting Kau Bridge at a closer or higher angle. The visitor centre and observation deck were opened to the public in 1997 with the opening of the Lantau Link."
    8. "遊車河攝影勝地青嶼幹線半日遊" [Half-day tour of Lantau Link, a great place for driving and photography]. PC Market [zh] (in Chinese). 2005-11-15. p. A82.
      The article notes: "青馬大橋除創造世界最長同類型吊橋紀錄外，包括青馬大橋在內的「機場核心計畫」也於1999 年榮獲美國建築界權威及編輯選為「二十世紀十大建築成就獎」得主之一，與巴拿馬運河、英法海峽隧道及三藩市金門大橋等其他九項工程齊名。位於青衣島西北端的青嶼幹線訪客中心及觀景台，是了解及觀賞這項壯觀建設的最佳地點，在訪客中心亦展出了幹線的模型，圖片及建築物樣本，於觀景台可將青嶼幹線的宏偉景色一覽無遺。"
      From Google Translate: "In addition to setting the world record for the longest suspension bridge of its kind, the "Airport Core Project" including the Tsing Ma Bridge was also selected by American architectural authorities and editors as one of the "Top Ten Architectural Achievements of the 20th Century" in 1999, along with nine other projects such as the Panama Canal, the Channel Tunnel and the San Francisco Golden Gate Bridge. The Lantau Link Visitor Centre and Observation Deck, located at the northwest end of Tsing Yi Island, is the best place to understand and appreciate this spectacular construction. Models, pictures and building samples of the link are also exhibited in the visitor centre, and the magnificent scenery of the Lantau Link can be seen at a glance from the observation deck."
    There is sufficient coverage in reliable sources to allow Lantau Link Visitors Centre and Viewing Platform (simplified Chinese: 青屿干线访客中心及观景台; traditional Chinese: 青嶼幹綫訪客中心及觀景台) to pass Wikipedia:Notability#General notability guideline, which requires "significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject".
    Cunard (talk) 10:31, 23 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Glad to see you found this @Cunard. I almost pinged you before I read @Prince of Erebor's user page and realized the extent to which they also had access to Chinese-language sourcing. Happy holidays and thanks as always for your detailed sourcing. Star Mississippi 15:44, 23 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I extend the same appreciation to Cunard! You are always able to locate a variety of offline sources! Four of the sources you found are currently unused and are definitely good additions to expand the article. —Prince of Erebor（The Book of Mazarbul） 16:20, 23 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It always great to see both of you! Thank you and happy holidays and New Year to both of you! Cunard (talk) 10:58, 27 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep. I think consensus above is that this Visitors Centre is notable, but there remains the question of merging/PAGEDECIDE. I personally see more than enough sourcing to create a proper article here, far beyond permastub territory, and I agree with Cunard that there isn't a great merge target. Probably Lantau Link would be the best merge target, but all suggestions above were for merging to Tsing_Ma_Bridge#Tourism. For these reasons I lean towards keeping this as a standalone article. Toadspike [Talk] 12:20, 27 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Owen× ☎ 14:06, 27 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]


Temmie Chang

Temmie Chang (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

This biography of a living person was published with no sources, and is promotional and unencyclopedic in tone. A ProQuest search yields 11 hits, all of which are brief mentions of her as a collaborator with Toby Fox and contributor of artwork to his video game, Undertale. A Google search yields more, but these do not meet Wikipedia standards for reliability (see WP:RELIABLESOURCES) and do not contribute to notability in the Wikipedia sense. Does not meet WP:BASIC, let alone WP:GNG. Cielquiparle (talk) 04:53, 28 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Redirect to Escaped Chasm. I've done source searching for her in the past out of curiosity regarding if she could have an article or not. She's not notable, and I don't think an argument could be made for her to pass WP:NARTIST either. So, with that being said, redirect this article to Escaped Chasm, which is a game that she created and actually has an article. λ NegativeMP1 04:57, 28 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete Unsourced WP:BLP. Sadly the page history shows this was never close to being adequately sourced. A redirect or merge to Escaped Chasm is not ideal as it doesn't contain biographical information and isn't the thing Chang is most known for, but is better than nothing! ＶＲＸＣＥＳ (talk) 21:04, 28 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep Meets WP:NCREATIVE #3 as she played a major role in co-creating Undertale as its lead artist and concept artist, which some might call one of the best known indie games ever made without hyperbole, as well as Deltarune with a similar role. If Escaped Chasm is actually notable, it would give further credence to her being a notable creative. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 01:35, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Unfortunately most of the coverage on Undertale focuses on Toby and mentions Temmie's role only very briefly (plus the fact that there is a creature named after her). Cielquiparle (talk) 02:08, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    This is completely wrong. Temmie is not regarded as a co-creator of Undertale, and she is only discussed as the artist for that game on the Undertale article (where she is covered in one sentence of the articles body). I also don't think NCREATIVE is valid here because of WP:INHERITED, due to the aforementioned lack of commentary about Temmie Chang's role in the game. There are practically zero reliable sources that discuss her as a person. λ NegativeMP1 02:19, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Redirect per NegativeMP. The page, as is, should be deleted due to the complete absence of sources. Madeleine (talk) 16:40, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep per the significant coverage in multiple independent reliable sources. The subject passes Wikipedia:Notability (people)#Basic criteria, which says:

    People are presumed notable if they have received significant coverage in multiple published secondary sources that are reliable, intellectually independent of each other, and independent of the subject.

    • If the depth of coverage in any given source is not substantial, then multiple independent sources may be combined to demonstrate notability; trivial coverage of a subject by secondary sources is not usually sufficient to establish notability.

    Sources

    1. Benoit-Gonin, Corentin (2023). L' anomalie Undertale Décryptage d'un Jeu Monstre [The Undertale Anomaly: Decoding a Monster Game] (in French). Namur: Third Éditions. ISBN 978-2-37784-433-3. Retrieved 2024-12-30 – via Google Books.

      The book discusses her on 3.25 pages. The book notes: "TEMMIE CHANG Certes, Undertale représente surtout le fruit de l'imagination de Toby Fox. Mais dire qu'il est le seul artisan du titre est exagéré. Parlons de Temmie Chang, ou Tuyoki, comme elle se fait souvent appeler en ligne. Née en 1993, elle a deux ans de moins que Fox et récolte une part importante des lauriers matérialisés par le jeu. Temmie Chang se découvre une passion pour les univers vidéo-ludiques très tôt, à l'époque où elle regardait son cousin jouer à Breath of Fire, un classique du J-RPG sur Super NES. L'ambiance lui tape dans l'œil, et plus encore le pixel art, tant ce style graphique se révèle capable de convoyer beaucoup d'émotions en montrant très peu. Autour de 2006, elle commence à comprendre qu'il est possible de produire de l'art numérique et de le partager sur Internet, notamment sur un site qui prend de plus en plus d'ampleur, DeviantArt. Sa famille l'encourage à poursuivre dans cette voie, ce qui la pousse à travailler son coup de stylet. En parallèle, d'autres créations pixelisées débarquent en ligne, par exemple les titres de 2004 Yume Nikki et Cave Story - ne vous en faites pas, on va très bientôt recroiser le chemin de ces deux-là dans ce livre – et avec eux de véritables fandoms12 dont les membres fournissent de magnifiques illustrations et de formidables petits métrages d'animation. ... Le refus de cette vision étriquée, mais répandue, de l'art la fait hésiter à se professionnaliser, mais elle opte finalement pour une formation en animation 2D qu'elle suit au Pratt Institute, un établissement à New York."

      From Google Translate: "TEMMIE CHANG Of course, Undertale is mostly the fruit of Toby Fox's imagination. But to say that he is the sole creator of the title would be an exaggeration. Let's talk about Temmie Chang, or Tuyoki, as she often goes by online. Born in 1993, she is two years younger than Fox and reaps a significant share of the game's laurels. Temmie Chang discovered her passion for video game universes very early on, when she watched her cousin play Breath of Fire, a classic J-RPG on Super NES. The atmosphere caught her eye, and even more so pixel art, as this graphic style is capable of conveying a lot of emotion by showing very little. Around 2006, she began to understand that it was possible to produce digital art and share it on the Internet, particularly on a site that was gaining momentum, DeviantArt. Her family encouraged her to continue in this direction, which pushed her to work on her pen stroke. At the same time, other pixelated creations arrived online, for example the 2004 titles Yume Nikki and Cave Story - don't worry, we'll soon cross paths with these two in this book - and with them real fandoms12 whose members provided magnificent illustrations and great short animated films. ... The rejection of this narrow but widespread vision of art made her hesitate to become a professional, but she finally opted for training in 2D animation that she followed at the Pratt Institute, an establishment in New York."

    2. Ayub, Simon (2020-11-04). "Temmie Chang: 10 facts you should know about the Undertale animator". Tuko.co.ke. Archived from the original on 2024-12-30. Retrieved 2024-12-30.

      The Reuters Institute for the Study of Journalism said, "In the online space, the digital native Tuko's mix of celebrity, entertainment, and political news with a light touch has proved successful." The article's tone is very positive about Temmie Chang. The article notes: "Temmie Chang was born on April 2, 1993, in Brooklyn, New York. This means that the talented animator is 27 years old as of 2020. The name Temmie was her grandmother's nickname. There is not much information about Temmie Chang’s parents and childhood. However, it is known that she graduated from the Pratt Institute in New York, which is a senior, private non-profit learning centre. Temmie graduated from the institution with a degree in 2D animation. This must have been the stepping stone to her remarkable career achievements in graphic designing and animation."

    There is sufficient coverage in reliable sources to allow Temmie Chang to pass Wikipedia:Notability#General notability guideline, which requires "significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject".

    Cunard (talk) 10:46, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Not convinced that Tuko.co.ke is a reliable source. But the book published by Third Editions looks like it could pass. Did you find any other sources? Cielquiparle (talk) 11:16, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The other sources I found were passing mentions. Tuko.co.ke has not been discussed at Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Noticeboard so it is unclear whether it is reliable. In my research, the website shows signs of reliability based on Wikipedia:Reliable sources#News organizations. The website has editorial oversight and editorial standards. The website publishes corrections like this one. Tuko.co.ke has been cited in numerous books such as The Oxford Handbook of Kenyan Politics (Oxford University Press), Kenyan, Christian, Queer: Religion, LGBT Activism, and Arts of Resistance in Africa (Penn State University Press), Understanding the Higher Education Market in Africa (Taylor & Francis), To be Or Not to be: Sudan at Crossroads: a Pan-African Perspective: a Black African Nation Undone by the Ideology of Islamo-Arabism (Mkuki na Nyota), Doing Business in Kenya: Opportunities and Challenges (Taylor & Francis), and Digital Kenya: An Entrepreneurial Revolution in the Making (Palgrave Macmillan). Reuters Institute for the Study of Journalism says on page 156, "Traditional media houses also face competition online from digital-born websites such as Tuku.co.ke, which reaches around 70% of our online sample each week. Much of its content is focused on entertainment and gossip attracting a younger audience. Tuku.co.ke also has a reputation for breaking and frequently updated news, which many older outlets struggle to match." Cunard (talk) 12:01, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Mavis Ma

Mavis Ma (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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This article seems to be written in a highly NPOV style, it almost reads like a political attack ad. I'm also not so sure this person even meets GNG and should not be considered notable through their brother(Although it is possible that I'm missing articles not in English). GoldMiner24 Talk 04:52, 27 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  • Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Politicians, Women, China, Hong Kong, Taiwan, Massachusetts, and New York. WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 05:21, 27 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep: I agree with the nom that the article currently documents too many "controversies" which potentially violates NPOV. Some minor incidents, such as the subject being scolded by her father in public or her endorsements of candidates, are totally UNDUE and can certainly be removed. However, I believe most content can stay, as much of the subject's political career involved dirty work, supported by numerous sources and opinion pieces like the one from Apple Daily by Neil Peng (source 33). Although NPOV is a serious concern, AFD is not cleanup, and I do not think notability is an issue for the subject. Currently, there are more than 30 sources listed in the article, with even more in the zhwiki one. I scanned through the first 10 sources, and sources 2, 4, 5, 6, 9, and 10 all provided SIGCOV on the subject and are certainly enough to pass GNG. Not to mention a simple Google News search can already yield many full articles about the subject, such as these articles from Central News Agency[8] and ETtoday[9]. I also think that her case regarding the violation of conflict of interest should be sufficient to meet WP:PERP. —Prince of Erebor（The Book of Mazarbul） 06:22, 27 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep per the significant coverage in multiple independent reliable sources. The subject passes Wikipedia:Notability (people)#Basic criteria, which says:

    People are presumed notable if they have received significant coverage in multiple published secondary sources that are reliable, intellectually independent of each other, and independent of the subject.

    • If the depth of coverage in any given source is not substantial, then multiple independent sources may be combined to demonstrate notability; trivial coverage of a subject by secondary sources is not usually sufficient to establish notability.

    Sources

    1. The sources listed by Prince of Erebor (talk · contribs) and those already in the article.
    2. Li, Hsin-i 李心怡 (2008-02-20). "馬以南作風大膽 拆掉馬英九包裝" [[Ma Yinan's Bold Style: Unveiling the True Image of Ma Ying-jeou]. New Taiwan Weekly [zh] (in Chinese). No. 622. Archived from the original on 2024-12-30. Retrieved 2024-12-30.

      The article notes: "原來，馬以南一九六二年考上台大外文系之後曾轉到植病學系，因此延畢一年；原來，馬以南在一九六六年曾替一考生代考大學聯考擔任「槍手」；原來，「槍手案」爆發後，檢方以陳姓考生未考取大學為由，未起訴馬以南，連罪證確鑿的偽造文書罪都沒有，也沒有被台大退學；原來，馬以南在案子起訴前已早一步前往美國求學、申請綠卡、當美國公民；原來，中央日報刊登所有涉案人詳細資料時，可以獨漏馬以南的犯罪事實、代價金額與知情家長姓名等資料；原來，馬英九一家享盡特權，媒體、司法遇到他們都沒轍；原來，所謂家教甚嚴的家庭，竟是教出說謊、詐欺、涉嫌貪污的子女。"

      From Google Translate: "It turns out that Ma Yin-nan, after being admitted to the Department of Foreign Languages at National Taiwan University in 1962, later transferred to the Department of Plant Pathology, which caused him to delay his graduation by one year. It turns out that in 1966, Ma Yin-nan acted as a "gunman" (substitute test-taker) for a student during the university entrance exams. It turns out that after the "gunman case" broke, the prosecutor did not indict Ma Yin-nan, citing that the student (Chen) did not get into a university, and even though there was solid evidence of forgery, he was not charged with falsifying documents, nor was he expelled from National Taiwan University. It turns out that before the case was prosecuted, Ma Yin-nan had already gone to the United States to study, applied for a green card, and became a U.S. citizen. It turns out that when the Central Daily News published detailed information about all those involved in the case, they conveniently omitted Ma Yin-nan's criminal facts, the amount of money involved, and the names of the parents who were aware of the situation. It turns out that the Ma Ying-jeou family enjoyed special privileges, with the media and the judiciary unable to do anything in the face of their influence. It turns out that the so-called "strict family upbringing" actually produced children who lied, committed fraud, and were suspected of corruption."

    3. Peng, Neil (2013-10-25). "【馮光遠專欄】馬英九的門神" [【Feng Kuan-yuan's Column】Ma Ying-jeou's Gatekeeper]]. Apple Daily (in Chinese). Archived from the original on 2015-09-24. Retrieved 2024-12-30.

      The article notes: "馬以南之所以又冒出來，因為她這個門神，事業做得還真大，除了增進身體健康的一堆藥廠請她守門，戕害身體健康的假油業者也找上她，可見外戚在今日台灣是同時受到健康跟不健康企業的愛戴。"

      From Google Translate: "The reason why Ma Yinan appears again is because she is a doorkeeper and has a really big career. In addition to a lot of pharmaceutical companies that improve health, she is hired to guard the door. She is also approached by fake oil companies that harm health. It can be seen that her relatives are in Today, Taiwan is loved by both healthy and unhealthy companies."

    4. Tsai, Ching-hsuan 蔡靚萱 (2010-02-03). "超完美箭靶 馬以南" [An Almost Perfect Target: Mavis Ma]. Yam [zh] (in Chinese). Archived from the original on 2014-12-21. Retrieved 2024-12-30.

      The article notes: "事實上，自從馬英九於二○○八年當選總統以後，過去在助選場合、黨務、生技製藥界相當活躍的馬以南，幾乎是被迫自縛雙手、低調過日子。不但辭去民間公司職務，曾高票當選國民黨中央委員的她，在國民黨擬定○九年中央委員候選名單時，因馬英九特別請黨主席吳伯雄「不要把我大姊放進去」，宣告正式退出黨務。"

      From Google Translate: "In fact, since Ma Ying-jeou was elected president in 2008, Ma Yinan, who used to be very active in campaign events, party affairs, and the biotech and pharmaceutical industry, has been almost forced to tie his hands and live a low-key life. Not only did she resign from a private company, but she was once elected as a member of the KMT Central Committee with a high vote. When the KMT was drawing up the candidate list for the 2009 Central Committee, Ma Ying-jeou specifically asked party chairman Wu Boxiong to "don't include my eldest sister in the list." She announced her official withdrawal from the party."

    There is sufficient coverage in reliable sources to allow Mavis Ma (traditional Chinese: 馬以南; simplified Chinese: 马以南) to pass Wikipedia:Notability#General notability guideline, which requires "significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject".

    Cunard (talk) 11:37, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Kdan Mobile

Kdan Mobile (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

No properly reliable sources, seemingly written by someone affiliated. Found a profile on CommonWealth Magazine (Taiwan), but that is not enough for company notability. IgelRM (talk) 20:05, 23 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  • Keep per the significant coverage in multiple independent reliable sources.
    1. Yan, Lou-you 顏漏有 (2022). 新創成長的關鍵：解開台灣新創企業從0到10億元的祕密 [The Key to Startup Growth: Unveiling the Secrets Behind Taiwanese Startups' Journey from $0 to $1 Billion] (in Chinese). Taipei: Business Weekly Publications 商周出版. ISBN 978-626-318-392-6. Retrieved 2024-12-29 – via Google Books.

      The book notes: "創業之初,正好抓住App發展初期,競爭者不多,當時蘋果應用程式商店 ( App Store)上的App總數還不到一千個,但凱鈿可以開發出上百個不同的 App,營收穩定成長,但沒多久,他們的發展、成長開始出現瓶頸。除了越來 越多新進開發者及大公司投入App開發,加上免費App的選擇變多,競爭加劇, 若要吸引使用者,勢必要加大行銷投資。另一個本質上的問題在於,使用者是 採取一次性付費買服務,但公司仍要持續提供維運,長久下去,不利於公司成長。"

      From Google Translate: "At the beginning of the business, Kdan caught the early stage of App development and there were not many competitors. At that time, the total number of Apps on the Apple App Store was less than a thousand, but Kdan could develop hundreds of different Apps, and the business Revenues grew steadily, but before long, bottlenecks began to appear in their development and growth. In addition to more and more new developers and large companies investing in App development, as well as the increasing number of free App choices and intensifying competition, it is necessary to increase marketing investment if you want to attract users. Another fundamental problem is that users pay a one-time fee for services, but the company still has to continue to provide maintenance and operation. In the long run, it is not conducive to the company's growth."

      The book notes: "然而,過去的模式主要靠著多樣化產品在支撐,精簡後,營收規模自然大 受影響,公司營運陷入極大困境,幾位創辦人不得不向員工承認錯誤,抵押、 賣地、信用卡借款,這些創業故事中常見的情節,也在凱鈿發生。"

      From Google Translate: "However, the past model was mainly supported by diversified products. After streamlining, the revenue scale was naturally greatly affected, and the company's operations were in great difficulties. The founders had to admit their mistakes to the employees, resorting to pledging assets, selling land, and borrowing on credit cards—common scenarios in startup stories, which also occurred at Kdan."

    2. "新創的國際化策略及管理精準掌握海外企業需求,他擁800萬會員走向B2B" [The Internationalization Strategy of Startups and Management: Precisely Understanding Overseas Business Needs, With 8 Million Members Moving Towards B2B]. BusinessNext 數位時代 (in Chinese). December 2020. pp. 50–51. Retrieved 2024-12-29 – via Google Books.

      The article notes: "2015 年,除了商業模式「轉彎」,凱鈿也開始收斂 App的開發數量,蘇柏州當時梳理出3個主要產品 線,包括 Document 365、Creativity 365 及Kdan Cloud。 直到 2019 年,團隊才又端出另一條產品線:點點簽 DottedSign。自高峰時期1年52款App,到深耕3~ 4款系列產品,他們開始專注於產品的整合,以提供更 好服務來維持用戶。2019 年,凱鈿訂閱戶的續訂率達8成、截至目前也 累積了 800 萬註冊會員,其中有約3萬筆企業客戶名 單,成為他們推廣SaaS服務的起點。"

      From Google Translate: "In 2015, in addition to the "turn" in its business model, Kdan also began to curb the number of app development. Subazhou sorted out three main product lines at that time, including Document 365, Creativity 365 and Kdan Cloud. It wasn’t until 2019 that the team launched another product line: DottedSign. From the peak of 52 apps per year to 3 to 4 product series, they began to focus on product integration to provide better services to maintain users. In 2019, the renewal rate of Kdan's subscribers reached 80%, and it has accumulated 8 million registered members so far, including about 30,000 corporate customer lists, which has become the starting point for them to promote SaaS services."

    3. Li, I-Ju 李宜儒 (2023-12-03). "台南億級APP一哥1／累計超過2億次的下載量　從閱讀器打造生態系" [Tainan's Billion-Level App Leader: Over 200 Million Downloads, Building an Ecosystem from a Reader]. Want Weekly [zh] (in Chinese). Archived from the original on 2024-12-29. Retrieved 2024-12-29.

      The article notes: "CTWANT記者調查，Kdan，其實是2009年在台南永康起家的本土APP軟體公司｢凱鈿」（Kdan），以APP搶快搶多求生，但在免費APP海量出現後險遭滅頂，轉而聚焦PDF工具用程式，並推出訂閱制服務，定期根據用戶反饋進行更新，獲得用戶好評，在2016年起獲得天使投資新台幣4000萬元，2018年完成A輪募資500萬美元（約新台幣1.5億元），由美商中經合集團、達盈管理顧問及日本Accord Ventures等共同投資。"

      From Google Translate: "According to CTWANT reporter's investigation, Kdan is actually a local APP software company "Kdan" (Kdan) founded in Yongkang, Tainan in 2009. It used APPs to grab the quickest and the most in order to survive. However, it was nearly wiped out after the massive emergence of free APPs, and it instead focused on PDFs. Tool program, and launched a subscription-based service, which is regularly updated based on user feedback, and has won praise from users. Since 2016, it has received angel investment of NT$40 million. In 2018, it completed the A-round fundraising of US$5 million (approximately NT$150 million). Yuan), jointly invested by the US-China Economic Cooperation Group, Daying Management Consultants and Japan's Accord Ventures."

    4. Lin, Joyce (2020-10-05). "The Top Taiwanese App Company You Never Heard Of". CommonWealth Magazine. Archived from the original on 2020-11-14. Retrieved 2024-12-29.

      The article notes: "Lman Chu (朱宜振), the founder and CEO of blockchain startup BiiLabs, said Kdan’s choice at its inception to develop “tool apps” was smart because those apps resonate across borders, helping penetrate overseas markets and build overseas teams. Not coincidentally, Kdan has focused mainly on users in Western countries. At present, the United States is Kdan’s biggest market, accounting for 40 percent of its revenues, with another 25 percent coming from Europe, 20 percent from China, 5 percent from Japan, and 10 percent from the rest of the world. Kdan’s apps have gained strong followings in the West because users see them as native English-language products."

    There is sufficient coverage in reliable sources to allow Kdan Mobile (traditional Chinese: 凱鈿; simplified Chinese: 凯钿) to pass Wikipedia:Notability (organizations and companies)#Primary criteria, which requires "significant coverage in multiple reliable secondary sources that are independent of the subject".

    Cunard (talk) 10:32, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for searching:
1. Mentions Asia America Multitechnology Association, does not appear particular independent?
2. A trade source, I found this about page.
3. Covers Kdan Office, Generative AI and Hancom, a bit about Kdan and an interview with chair 蘇柏州.
4. (I will note that I had already linked CommonWealth mag in my nomination).
So I don't think the sources here are extraordinary.
Edit: Had accidentally swapped 1 and 2. I found a profile on chinatimes.com, a rather promotional article on businesstoday.com.tw and one comparison to Adobe by Techcrunch. IgelRM (talk) 23:11, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I consider the first source to be independent. It is unclear to me where Asia America Multitechnology Association is mentioned and why this would mean the source is not independent. BusinessNext is a business magazine focused on the technology and Internet sectors, which has a much broader scope than a trade magazine dedicated to a particular field. I consider it to be sufficiently independent to establish notability. The third and fourth sources include enough independent reporting and analysis about Kdan Mobile to establish notability. Cunard (talk) 01:42, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Relisting. I'd like further review of these new sources. Remember, they do not have to be "extraordinary", just sufficient to establish notability.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 21:31, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Quelle: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:DSZH