The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. postdlf (talk) 23:34, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

List of video game franchises (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log · Stats)

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This page is overflowing with standalone entries, has no sources or any kind of notability, and a category would be better suited for this. Withdrawn. Namcokid47 (talk) 20:09, 26 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Video games-related deletion discussions. ~ Amory (u • t • c) 20:59, 26 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Lists-related deletion discussions. ~ Amory (u • t • c) 20:59, 26 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep – for two reasons

• Per WP:NOTDUP relative to Category:Video game franchises.
• Per WP:LISTPURP as a valuable navigational aid, in part per having received 8,794 page views in the last thirty days.
• Conversely, the category page has only received 1,381 page views in the last thirty days.
• Ultimately, the article is of more use to Wikipedia's readers compared to the category page. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 00:01, 27 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep. That a category exists is not a reason for deletion and problems with entries can be handled by editing, not deletion. Notability concerns are not relevant for navigational aid lists. Instead of starting an AFD discussion, raise the problem with the inclusion criteria on the talk page and maybe WT:VG. Regards SoWhy 08:55, 27 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete - Basically, the points I noted on the article's talk page a year and a half ago still hold true. While list articles are not redundant to categories in general, the content of this list is completely identical to the content of the corresponding category, a simple wikilinked list, and no one has yet suggested a reasonable reformat that would make it not redundant to the category. I tried to come up with something myself and couldn't. If someone else has a good idea I'm all for it, but it's useless to say "just fix the article" if we have no idea how it can be fixed.--Martin IIIa (talk) 15:40, 27 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

• I don't understand your argument. 1) It's not a problem to be redundant to a category. That's not a valid reason for deletion. 2) Who doesn't understand how to clean it up? I do. Remove the erroneous entries that aren't franchises. That's it. Differentiation from categories isn't something necessary to aspire to, and certainly isn't a reason to default to deleting the list. Sergecross73 msg me 15:08, 29 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

• Simply saying "It's not a problem to be redundant to a category." is not an argument. Why is it not a problem?--Martin IIIa (talk) 15:10, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

• I didn't "simply say" it. You see that blue text in my last comment? It's me citing a guideline. I linked you to WP:NOTDUP, which directly calls your stance an argument to avoid. A person who commented before you did cited this as well... Sergecross73 msg me 22:49, 2 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep - Many of the policy based rationales have been described above. AfD is not cleanup and this is a valid listing. -- Dane ^talk 01:39, 28 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep - I agree that it's in terrible shape, but it is a notable subject. Its a problem that occurs frequently on Wikipedia - example bloat. Rather than listing off actual series/franchises, people just list off every video game they can think of. It just needs a major cleanup...and sadly constant, frequent maintenance. Irritating, but I'll start working on it... Sergecross73 msg me 12:33, 29 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment - Update: I've removed a ton of entries, but there have been a staggering number of erroneous entries so far, and there are certainly many more to go. I've started a discussion on the talk page about formal inclusion criteria, if anyone wants to give their 2 cents there. Also, I've noticed that large numbers of erroneous entries seems to be coming from IP editors, so once we have a good consensus on inclusion criteria, if they persist against consensus, we can look into page protection too. Sergecross73 msg me 14:14, 29 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Agreed. Withdrawn. Namcokid47 (talk) 01:18, 30 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

• delete First of all, it does duplicate the category, being simply a list of links to articles and nothing else. Second, it perhaps only gets more hits than the category because Google happens to list it first. Unless there is other info which can be put on the page besides sheer inclusion, the category should stand alone. Mangoe (talk) 14:57, 29 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment - Mangoe - I think you're misunderstanding WP:NOTDUP. It says that its acceptable to be a duplicate of a category. So claiming that the list duplicates a category is not a valid argument for deletion (nor is the rest of your argument.) Sergecross73 msg me 15:08, 29 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment - Also of note - sourcing such a list shouldn't be an issue either. (Other than the time/effort it'll take to do everything.) For example, if you just Google something like "Sonic the Hedgehog franchise", you quickly find a a reliable source like this that calls it a franchise. Or, alternative, if you search for something more broad like "Top Video Game Franchises", you come up with this IGN source, which will provide sources for 25 different entries. It may be harder to sources some of these more obscure entries, but then again, maybe that is a sign that they should be trimmed off the list eventually too. Sergecross73 msg me 12:38, 30 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep as a valid navigational list which complements a category of the same name. Only bluelinks are included (there are hundreds) and the distinction of whether it can be listed under a video game franchise can be included inside the individual article. Ajf773 (talk) 04:38, 31 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

This has already been withdrawn. Namcokid47 (talk) 04:50, 31 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.