Eisspeedway

Talk:Belfast–Dublin line

Untitled

The statement that
"This led to a running down of rail services in Northern Ireland, with the main line to Belfast closed in 1965.[citation needed] The newly formed Northern Ireland Railways reopened it in 1969"
appears spurious, as according to [1]:
"the proposed singling of the cross-border line south of Portadown was not well received by CIÉ and, following negotiations between the two governments, the matter was dropped. The line did in fact close for 22½ hours during 1966 on the orders of the Northern Ireland Government. Sunday, 17th April marked the 50th anniversary of the Easter Rising and a large demonstration was planned for Belfast to commemorate the event with a large contingent expected to travel from Dublin by train. The Stormont Government, fearing riots at Great Victoria Street station, ordered that no trains enter Northern Ireland from the Republic between 2130 hrs on the Saturday and 1900 hrs on the Sunday"
Suckindiesel (talk) 11:50, 1 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

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More info?

Is the line single or double track? This would be useful info for having a view on the potential of the line. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 46.18.108.90 (talk) 09:12, 23 June 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Title

Why is article called Belfast-Dublin, as line starts from the then capitol, Dublin? After all, mile posts are measured from Amiens St., and the GNRI, who operated the line for much of its history were headquartered there.

Info box says 8 stations, probably the number served by the Enterprise. However, I count about 35 on the route map.

Suckindiesel (talk) 12:55, 23 June 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The title used to be Dublin–Belfast until an IP requested to have them in alphabetical order. I couldn't check the mileage but if it starts at Dublin we should move the article to Dublin–Belfast line. Common usage can't be determined here because they are constructed terms that are rarely used in general. --PhiH (talk) 17:29, 7 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

this page does not render properly on my mobile device

"history description references" etc are rendered vertically (generally one letter per line) and inside the image. Android, Chrome Al Begamut (talk) 12:57, 25 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Merger Discussion

I propose merging the Belfast–Newry line article into the Dublin–Belfast line article. The Belfast–Newry line constitutes a segment of the larger Dublin–Belfast route. Consolidating this information would create a comprehensive resource encompassing all aspects of the Dublin–Belfast line. Additionally, merging these articles would reduce redundancy and improve the coherence of related content. RooneyDonal21 (talk) 15:08, 28 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I think it makes sense, given it’s like only half the line. Since we’re talking about merging the Belfast-Newry into the Dublin-Belfast line, I’ve recently been wondering if we should do a similar thing with places that at one point or another, had more than one railway station, like Cookstown for example, which had two railway stations for the GNRI and NCC respectively, or how about Banbridge, which had one station for the Banbridge Junction Railway, but was later replaced with the Banbridge, Lisburn and Belfast Railway's station. Yeah I’m probably getting a bit off topic with this, but given we’re on the topic of merging the Belfast-Newry line into the larger Dublin-Belfast one, I do think this might be worth a discussion at some point, especially since the articles for each of those are pretty short. JoshuaW56 (talk) 16:23, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Hi RooneyDonal21. Sorry for the delayed reply. I have no strong opinions either way and am happy to go with any majority view. But to play devil's advocate, there are some things we might need to bear in mind (sorry in advance for the wall of text - just throwing thoughts out there!):
- I think this brings up a wider question of lines/infrastructure vs services, and whether a service (Belfast-Portadown/Newry) has enough unique identity to warrant having a page in its own right separate from the page on the underlying infrastructure (the Dublin-Belfast line). There are examples going both ways with lines in GB and further afield. International lines seem to have no consistent treatment - some have one distinct page for the line infrastructure, some have pages for the respective services but none for the line itself, some do both. I think it really seems to come down to that identity question. If we were being really really pedantic, the Bangor Line is arguably part of the Dublin Line infrastructure, since the Dublin mileposts continue on from Lanyon to Bangor rather than re-zero. But the Bangor Line clearly has a separate unique identity and nobody would ever think of it in the context of the Dublin Line. Whether the same applies to Portadown/Newry, I don't feel I can judge so happy to go with what others think.
- Given that it's Northern Ireland and a border-spanning line, we could be opening the door to politics here and the merged page will need to be written with that sensitivity in mind. You'd be subsuming a page which currently has an entirely Northern Irish focus, into one where (on the face of it) the Republic would be the main focus (since most of the line is in the south) and NI would be a secondary focus - especially if it's named 'Dublin-Belfast line'. Infrastructure-wise it makes complete sense as Dublin is bigger, the zero milepost is at Connolly, the IÉ services use the line more intensively than NIR, and the Enterprise is run with Belfast as 'down' anyway. But if we have particularly partisan editors out there, one particular side of the community might grumble. Perhaps I'm overthinking it given the number of times I've had to revert edits against WP:DERRY (from both sides)!
On JoshuaW56's point about merging station pages - again I think it comes down to that case-by-case question of whether a station has enough unique identity and geographical separation to warrant its own page separate from other similarly-named stations in the same locality. As an extreme example - merging Queen's Quay, GVS and York Road into a single "Belfast terminal stations" page wouldn't really make sense because they're all highly different with distinct detailed histories, were in separate parts of the city from each other, and served very different routes (at first). Time may play a factor too, i.e. if stations did or didn't co-exist at the same time. Banbridge and Cookstown are good examples for merging though Joshua, since the individual pages are basically stubs anyway. I think pages can support multiple infoboxes, so they could still maintain unique levels of detail in that respect. Service boxes on adjacent station pages could just direct-link to the respective section within the merged page.
Apologies for the rambling on! ~Karl~ 15:34, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for your detailed thoughts. Here’s my perspective:
Identity of Services vs. Infrastructure: While the Belfast-Portadown/Newry service has its own quirks, it's fundamentally part of the larger Dublin-Belfast line. For instance, we only have about four trains going to and from Grand Central to Newry each day (excluding Sunday), while the cross-border Enterprise is much busier. Plus, there aren’t separate tracks for each line; the Enterprise can’t run if there’s an NIR commuter train from Portadown stuck at Lurgan. This overlap makes merging the articles a sensible move, cutting down on redundancy and providing a clearer picture of the whole route.
Political Sensitivity: I get the concern about the cross-border nature of the line. We can handle the merged article with care to ensure Northern Ireland’s context is well-represented alongside the Republic of Ireland’s perspective. The aim is to create a unified resource that reflects the shared history and importance of the Dublin-Belfast line, including the Belfast-Newry stretch.
Also, we can cover stations on the northern commuter belt to Dublin Connolly since all mileposts point there. This would give a complete view of the route. We’ll also make sure to share the article fairly between both regions, noting that there are 18 stations in IÉ and 15 in NIR. RooneyDonal21 (talk) 01:18, 5 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Quelle: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Belfast%E2%80%93Dublin_line